Fucking AssholesâŚ(which could apply to any number of âfightersâ in many various countries at the moment).
Yeah. I look at the shot of the one (assumed) militia member holding a rifle at his waist, standing in a pile of wreckage and I have to think, exactly what the FUCK are you going to do with that weapon in that place? Not enough violence spread around the ground for you?
In fairness, while that guy shouldnât be stepping on stuff, and I assume that hell hath no fury like the NTSB for people like him; âguys standing around with guns in something more or less vaguely resembling a cordonâ is 100% standard for air crashes and other investigation sites the world over.
Some jurisdictions are classier about it, with pre-printed âPolice Line Do Not Crossâ tape and peons who know to stand around the site rather than on it; but uncontrolled access to a crash site doesnât exactly improve the chances of the investigative team, once the gawkers, souvenir hunters, anyone with an interest in evidence tampering, scrap metal collectors, journalists, bereaved relatives, etc. have had a chance to pick through it, and thatâs what the armed âsecurityâ types are for.
Admiring his handiwork.
OK, thatâs just gross.
I can only hope it was over instantly for all the souls on board wherever they may be now. For the cowards behind this, you forfeit all claim to mercy. I hope the face of each destroyed life haunts you to till your death.
Sending the NTSB to investigate would be like sending an arson investigator to Dresden.
âAccident investigationsâ are for accidents.
âAccident investigationsâ are for all sorts of mishaps.
We donât even know for certain a missile was involved. The time and place tempts to think so, but if that is the case, there will be telltale signs on the wreckage. All we know is that journalists claim it was a missile.
Also, does downing a wrong target count as accident? These things happen rather routinely.
Boing Boing, you have just published images of the dead bodies of loved ones only moments after the event. They probably havenât even been identified yet. Please take them down. Have a little respect.
All the horror and youâre complaining a soldier sent to secure the area has a gun on him? o_0 They are in a middle of an armed conflict over there.
eta:
You assume the Ukraine has such an entity that gives a fuck. I can see a few car loads come out with guys in black suits, âDa, looks like plane crash. Case closed.â
I agree with this entirely. Photos such as this are not ânews.â It is more akin to trying to see dead bodies when you drive by an auto accident. Seeing these pictures just says: âYup, a plane crashed. Debris everywhere.â We donât need to see this. Bad taste.
Maybe donât click on a link that says: âWarning - graphic imagesâ.
Honestly, I didnât even realize there were any human remains shown until a second, closer look.
Right. So itâs worth reading this:
Igor Sutyagin, a Russian military specialist at the London-based Royal United Services Institute, agreed that the plane would almost certainly have been hit from a Buk, a vehicle-mounted missile system first developed in the Soviet era. The Malaysian aircraft, flying at more than 10,000 metres, was beyond the range of MANPAD, shoulder-launched missiles. Kalashnikov-carrying Russian sympathisers in Ukraine would not have had the expertise to fire them and would have needed either specialists who had âvolunteeredâ their services from Russia or locally-recruited specialists, he said, but noted that the rebels had been firing at Ukrainian aircraft over the last week.
However, a report on the website of Russian state television from late June described how the rebels in Donetsk had taken control of of a Ukrainian missile defence facility which was equipped with Buk systems. The report said that the rebels planned to âdefend the sky over Donetskâ using the missile system.
On Thursday afternoon, a social media site attributed to Igor Strelkov, a Russian citizen who has emerged as the commander of rebel forces in Donetsk, announced that the rebels had shot down an An-26 Ukrainian transport plane, and also that there was âinformation about a second planeâ. The post was later removed.
Iâd say that draws a picture of âshoot anything down you canâ. For all we know, other civilian aircraft have been targeted and missed.
This is a monumental, utterly tragic, sickening mess.
I do not endorse the idea; but I think that Iâd be a fool to doubt it.
Once every decade or two doesnât count as routine.
They wonât have an easy time getting access(and may or may not succeed, remains to be seen); but the airline, the aircraft manufacturer, and frequently multiple nation states with dead nationals(and/or a national airline, or both) involved, all tend to converge around a large aircraft incident. If they can get access, Iâd be shocked if the investigation remains a local matter because they donât, as a rule. Any country with a dead national will want at least a token presence, the manufacturer and airline operator want to know what happened and whether it has implications for maintenance/modification of other aircraft in service, and anybody who suspects negligence or malice will want their forensics people involved.
I donât know if theyâll get what they want; but if they donât it wonât be because of apathy, itâll take active stonewalling.
Civilian aircraft do not become victim of such mishaps that often, youâre right here. However, shooting at a wrong target in general is a rather disconcertingly common thing. Even to oneâs own units, which is known as âfriendly fireâ, which does not actually feel that friendly to its recipients.
NBC News is currently reporting that U.S. investigators have evidence it was indeed shot down.
I doubt that there will be any stonewalling. In a situation like this, where the entire world is watching, stonewalling will instantly make you the âbad guy.â The ONLY reason to stonewall is if you have something to hide. However, even the guy who pulled the trigger can somehow be made a scapegoat. There is not scapegoat for stonewalling.
