Is the statement "humans are trash" controversial?

In a recent topic, @tinoesroho said

I don’t disagree with any of this, but to me it’s a given that people are the source of, and (rarely) the solution to, all problems. In other words:

I agree with this, but it does not go far enough. Humans are trash. That is the deeper truth. Always have been, always will be. Homo sapiens was a mistake.

If you look at the raw amount of pain and suffering that humans have inflicted on each other throughout recorded history, there’s no avoiding this conclusion. I am absolutely trash. As are you. As are all of us. Trash is our species level default. All we can really hope for is to be slightly less trash in the future?

And on that last point, I’m no longer optimistic.

To be fair, Nature is filled to the brim with fucking asshole animals. See: Mallard ducks. Blue Jays. Cats. Raccoons. Just about any given parasite (jesus christ, look up Ommatokoita elongata).

The difference between them and us is thumbs and brains.



Dude… You’re setting a really piss poor example with all your recent disingenuous behavior.

Nature (human or otherwise) isn’t the problem; the choices that people make are.

That is all.


Why should I listen to anything you have to say? You just told me you’re trash!


Incinerate? Reduce, recycle, reuse?

Honestly the world would be better off if there were less and not more humans. I hope the birth rate continues to stabilize before global warming becomes irreversible.

Like I said, no longer optimistic about this stuff. I kinda regret having kids TBH

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.


You can trivially mute the topic, so that’s not correct.

“You can trivially mute the topic, so that’s not correct.”

So - why did you add an ignore feature if it has no value?


I hope that you at least have enough good sense/empathy/compassion to never to share that with them.



The present is scary. The future is even scarier. But defeatism solves NO problems, ever.

Where I’m from, we don’t just ‘lay down and rot’, we don’t wallow in our misery and just wait for shit to get worse; we rise up and fucking fight to our very last, in whatever ways we can.

And that’s coming from someone who has never had even a fraction of the inherent unearned privilege that comes with being an able-bodied, straight, cisgendered, heteronormative White dude.


Topics vs. people

It’s not controversial, it’s just plain wrong.
You literally have the choice not to piss in your own cornflakes each morning. But hey, if you like the taste, you go ahead. But please stop pissing in ours.


Beyond the teleology of your statement, this is Some all lives matter scale evasion of the entire point of Men Are Trash.

And given that “recorded” history
primarily concerns (to use the parlance of our times) the 1%, it should be no surprise that it’s filled to the brim with avarice and hate.


Today it seems to me that whether anything is controversial or not depends on who is saying it, and has nothing to do with the content of their speech. Your detractors will deconstruct, misquote or reinterpret your meaning as required to suit their venomous outrage, and your admirers will do the same to make your words fit what they think you should have meant or to massage your ego.

So I don’t think you learn anything except who your friends and enemies are when you ask a question like that online. But, putting that aside for a moment, here’s my personal strategy for dealing with the issues of human perfidy and meretriciousness:

And remember, you can make great art from trash.


It’s not meant to be, but I think humans are born selfish to the point of borderline evil, and everything else has to be trained, with varying levels of success.

A fair point. To the extent that the world evolves towards democracy and representational government, things could get better? I guess that goes back to “has to be trained”, when you are born into an authoritarian or autocratic regime you are being trained in a negative way.

Piping hot take: neither humans, nor men are trash. Women are also not trash. In fact, there is no demographic that is trash. Even the profoundly misguided, even the evil are not trash.

Either we are a special creation of some divinity (in which case the worth of humans is in the hands of said divinity, reportedly such entities find us troubled, but promising) or we are evolved. If we are evolved we are the sole purveyors of meaning within the range of our sensors. As far as we know this right here is it. On one side, 93 billion light years of mostly empty, mostly irradiated, mostly bitterly cold space speckled with fire, on the other hand: seven billion apes with delusions of grandeur. And that’s (as far as we know) it.

Simply put: we don’t get to quit. Chance or providence has granted us a miracle and we are stuck with it.

Have we done poorly? By which standard? Of gods? We make poor gods, true. But for self-assembling chemical soup I think we’re pretty awesome.

As for the infliction of suffering, please. We are the scions of four billion years of mindless gnawing, of suffering-of-necessity, of devouring, being devoured, of parasitic wasps and things that only really reproduce via rape. Can we be better? Absolutely. Are we the worst? Not even close. We don’t even win in the ‘ecological damage’ niche. Cyanobacteria win there, probably.

The point is precisely that we can be much, much, much better. That we can improve the world and build the next best thing to paradise right here on Earth. And we can fail at this task and disappoint some of us bitterly precisely because we are not trash.


This resonates with me. We don’t get to quit, we are stuck with this whether we like it or not. In fact what you “like” matters not at all.

It is the “moving to Canada doesn’t do a damn thing to fix the country you live in” argument for Americans.

1 Like

There is way too much vitriol being directed at specific users here.

If you disagree with a position, then argue the position, don’t sling insults at the person holding the position, please.

While the position in the post is hyperbolic, that doesn’t mean it’s open season on the poster in violation of our guidelines.

Thank you.


I am OK with it and I understand it is an unpopular opinion. It is also my truth and I want to understand why it is unpopular.

I do not take positions to troll or “piss” on others. I may be weird, but I don’t do that.


Having children with completely different genetics than your own can provide a great deal of interesting data about inborn human behavioral traits. I can confidently state that not all humans are “born selfish” - although some humans certainly are, and it does often seem to run in genetic lines. But as you implied, good parenting and a supportive community can be defined as employing every child’s strengths and training away their weaknesses.


You may be ok with it, but I’m not ok with the precedent it sets for how unpopular opinions are handled here.

This is a community topic, which tend to be more lightly moderated than Boing frontpage topics, but the rules of respect still apply, and posts that cannot do so will be eaten.