Amtrak Explorer: online interactive map of the U.S. passenger train system

Amtrak was formed because private ownership of passenger rail service failed and it was going under nationwide.

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Government subsidies, land grants, and exploitation of immigrants

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And of course theft from indigenous peoples, just to round out the list of rugged individualist bootstraps.

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Yes, sorry! My response was off the top of my uncaffeinated head, and I’m not a historian, but I should have included theft. Thank you. I’m sure that there’s much more to add from those who are more knowledgeable about the subject, too

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sloth no GIF

Let’s not go back to how they did shit in the 19th century, since it came with much misery on the part of pretty much everyone who wasn’t a wealthy baron benefiting from the high level of exploitation that built the railroads…

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And the trains in turn served as a way to increase wanton, genocidal shooting of a food (and more) source, bison.

Massive hunting parties began to arrive in the West by train, with thousands of men packing .50 caliber rifles, and leaving a trail of buffalo carnage in their wake. Unlike the Native Americans or Buffalo Bill, who killed for food, clothing and shelter, the hunters from the East killed mostly for sport. Native Americans looked on with horror as landscapes and prairies were littered with rotting buffalo carcasses. The railroads began to advertise excursions for “hunting by rail,” where trains encountered massive herds alongside or crossing the tracks. Hundreds of men aboard the trains climbed to the roofs and took aim, or fired from their windows, leaving countless 1,500-pound animals where they died.

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This one has always perplexed me. Most of the track is owned by those freight companies and not by Amtrak, hence why they always have to wait. This is in stark contrast to the highway system that is owned by the government (mostly).

The majority of this track is owned by Amtrak, which is why it works so much better. Still, most of it isn’t that spectacular. Between Boston and DC, Acela only saves 90 minutes at most vs the standard regional train. There’s just not enough decent track to create a larger difference.

The schedule says:

  • Regional Train - 8:00 hours - $150 (ish)
  • Acela Train - 6:40 hours. - $350 (ish)
  • Google Maps Car (with some traffic) - 8:35. $130 (ish)
  • Plane - 1:40 - $140 (ish)
  • Megabus - 9:30 - $70

Not just extra time, but extra cost too. With the comparative extra time and cost, the act of being on the train needs to be part of the desired experience not just generic transportation for most people.

All of this could be improved, but it would take a bunch of investment. Just like everything else in the US, we’ve optimized for cars. By the time that car trip looks too long, the airplane has taken over. The two forces pushing out the train based on current investment. We could make the trains better, we’ve just chosen not to.

The Boston-NY trip instead is a little better comparison. The Acela still only saves 30 minutes vs the regional train, but the cost difference is much smaller. This works well for a day trip, where you go both ways in a single day. Since saving an hour in the round trip, the reduced cost difference, and the long day that a day trip between Boston and NY represents all come into play. That trip is also compact enough and the airports busy enough that the airport time and delays are bigger than the actual flight time.

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High speed trains can only compete with air travel in distances around 400 miles.
Going from city centre to city centre in 2 to 2 :30 hours. Not to cross from coast to coast

I am sure there are plenty of cities in the US within that range

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You’re much better off flying from Philly to Boston. Cheaper than the train and an hour and a half travel time.

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True, but then you have to deal with PHL and Logan. (Part of) the wonder of the train is that you can turn up 20 minutes before departure and not break out in a sweat. Transit to and from the train station is easier than the airport in many cities as well. When I’m deciding whether to take the train or the plane, I definitely include those travel factors in my calculus, and for a trip like Philly to Boston, the train frequently still wins. It does require one’s own schedule to be more adaptable, though, since there are fewer trips available.

The cost thing is pretty variable too; if you can book ahead you can get saver fares in the northeast corridor for stupid cheap. About a month out you can find PHL-BOS round trips for under $70 on the NER, but airfare is over $100, at least for the dates I picked. (With absolute flexibility on travel dates, airfare can definitely beat the train though. But I’d pay a money AND time premium to never have to set foot in an airport, myself.)

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For me - Philly to NY or DC - the train is the only way to go.

Boston- not so much.

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But, but, but… PROGRESS!!! It was just inevitable that that happened!!! /s

The fact that people are still pushing the “manifest destiny” bullshit about the conquest of the west is so fucking depressing… yet here we are.

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Now that I think of it though the big railroad systems I know about in India were funded by colonialism and put there by colonists for their own utility too in part to subjugate the native population same as the US. China is a pretty authoritarian government but they have had great success with trains.

I think it is possible big highways and road projects might require resources that defy the logical and emotional demands of markets.

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Right? Our destiny as a land-stealing, murderous empire just keeps on manifesting. :confounded:

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I wonder what proportion of all passenger journeys are over 400 miles.

I’m thinking that you don’t have a coast to coast railway specifically for people who want to go coast to coast. It’s there because lots of shorter inter-city legs join up.

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I rode both the Zephyr and the Empire Builder before Amtrak even existed. My dad liked to travel but didn’t like flying so much.

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that’s just flying time though, right? ( and does the price include fees? ) you’ve still got to get to and from the airport, and through the dehumanizing processing of airport security

depending on the city, many train stations are right in the city, and as @wazroth says: you just walk on last minute. it’s a great option for some cities and some trips. ( and obviously it could be so much more so than it is now )

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The 3 hour train ride from NYC to Albany/Rensselaer is a fucking delight. Along the Hudson, with great views (a bald eagle once accompanied the train for part of the ride), smooth as butter ride. Obviously the ride back is better :wink: (gotcha R.O.S.)

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Google Flights reported flight duration and rough price from among the search results.

Between Boston and DC is in that 400 mile ish range. It’s also either end of a huge population density belt geographically. You can get to both via the T and Metro for both airport and Amtrak. To make it a relatively comparable thing.

The hassle of air travel is definitely a problem. Especially if you actually show up 2 hours early. Still, in this example that would be like:

  • Regional Train - 8:00 hours/$150 vs Plane 4 hours/$150 - The train costs more time.
  • Acela Train - 6:40 hours/$350 vs Plane 4 hours/$150 - The train cost more time and money.
    The plane costs more humanity in both cases.

If we had better actual high speed rail and the train here was 3:00 hours, it would be an easy train win. For the existing Acela service, 200 miles is a better sweet spot. Especially if it’s a round trip in a day. So, Boston to NY. NY to DC. Philadelphia to NY/Baltimore/DC. The Philadelphia to BWI Amtrak route makes for a pleasant round trip to Philadelphia, even on the regional train.

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