kickstarter shows backers what’s been raised. people understood clearly when they donated. and, i have a very hard time understanding this argument as anything other than jealousy.
she’s not a game developer, and money doesn’t make you a developer. she’s a feminist, a game critic - as in book or movie critic, not a hater of games - a social commentator, many positive things.
i’d happily fund her continued work, and so would many others. just exactly the way i like to fund cory ( sorry, cory! ) by buying his books. i hope they both lead good lives, enriched by the excellent work they do.
I have to say, since the only remaining “On Topic” parts of this thread seem to be bizarre allegations that the threats are somehow “Faked”, or related to some kind of Kickstarter Fraud, whatever the hell that might be, two topics that seem so far beyond the pale that most of us won’t even touch them they’re so incendiary, I’d contend that your efforts here will add more smoke than fire, not less. Oh well, useful discussion seems to have ended some time ago anyway.
Has anyone identified a person making these threats? I’m curious to see if these are threats coming from 10-15 yo kids or if adults have been doing this.
I’ve never actually met an adult that would do this sort of thing that I’m aware of but I know plenty of snot nosed brats who would. I do accept, since I have been told, that there are adult males who would do this sort of thing. It just seems like the sort of thing a child would do.
I would call that a run of good luck (or, more likely, a tendency to see the best in people you encounter rather than to imagine them doing lousy things - you probably have met such people but just never thought of them that way).
I have a toddler, a large number of times I’ve been amazed by how my toddler behaves only to, moments later, think, “Oh yeah, I guess adults are like that too.” If only there were some magical line between childhood and adulthood where we started “acting like adults.”
Kevin Dobson is the name on the tweets. As to whether or not that’s a real name, or a hacked account? Who knows unless those with access to all our internets investigate.
If everyone emotionally progressed past adolescence, there wouldn’t be workplace bullying.
Seems like the sort of thing that stalkers of celebrities do. (warning, those are some scary stories, but not much different than the tweets sent in this case)
Given that video games are about as popular as movies, it’s fair to assume that video game celebrities will attract their own stalkers.
Few other women in video games are getting the same press visibility as Anita Sarkeesian right now. The logical and safe thing to do is to take this shit seriously.
If you’re going to conjecture that George Lucas probably gets the same quantity and quality of harassment and threats that prominent women on the Internet do, the responsibility is on you to provide some shred of evidence. Otherwise, you’re just playing “let’s pretend” and trying to demand that your fantasy life serve as the boundaries of the discussion.
I suspect that one way to help things improve would be a similar kind of recommendation to the one Thomas of “Yes Means Yes” makes at the end of his infamous “Meet the Predators” post about rape. He writes:
Change the culture. We are not going to pull six or ten or twelve
million men out of the U.S. population over any short period, so if we
are going to put a dent in the prevalence of rape, we need to change the
environment that the rapist operates in. Choose not to be part of a
rape-supportive environment. Rape jokes are not jokes. Woman-hating
jokes are not jokes. These guys are telling you what they think. When
you laugh along to get their approval, you give them yours. You tell
them that the social license to operate is in force; that you’ll go
along with the pact to turn your eyes away from the evidence; to make
excuses for them; to assume it’s a mistake, of the first time, or a
confusing situation. You’re telling them that they’re at low risk.
So, I would suggest that cutting down on the amount of harassment and griefing that women get might start by men speaking up whenever you see it: in comment sections, on Twitter, in blog posts, etc. Every time some jerk writes “I hope you get raped” where you can read it, reply with “not cool, man” or “that’s really gross; grow up” or “cut that out” or “if you have something useful to say, say it, but otherwise knock it off.” If you run a forum, aggressively delete such comments and make it clear why. If you see it cropping up in @ replies on Twitter, drown it out. Change the culture a little bit at a time through collective action.
I bet you’d take it a lot more seriously if some troll was threatening you or members of your family with rape or death, & had proved that they knew your address.
I think some men stay away from this work, in part, because it’s often low paid, undervalued labor. There is a long history of women’s work being undervalued, especially in terms of pay. At a recent talk with a woman who works on these issues (she’s a dean at a business school), she pointed out that while HR used to be well-respected and have good pay, the numbers of completely reversed in part because women now dominate the field (you could argue with her about causation, etc, but there is something going on).
Men are not being kept out because they are men, but because they are acting non-gender conforming (by wanting to care for children - something that has a long history of being women’s work). I think it’s a bit absurd that because men are being kept out of low paying, socially undervalued work, they are victimized the same way that women are within a sexist society. I agree that men suffer under the patriarchal structure too, but it really isn’t the same as to how women are treated. It’s just not. And if we do address issues women face, I’d imagine that the men who are victimized will see an improvement in their treatment, too.
So, Sarkeesian should just ignore all the threats, the doxxing, all the rest? Why? Will that make it stop? Over a decade of “Don’t feed the trolls” hasn’t stopped the misogyny; will another decade break the back of it?
Besides, at what point should she take notice? When a troll sends her threatening mail? When they steal her laundry? When they come up to her on the street? When they break into her home? Or will the message then be that she should have dealt with it earlier?
It’s very easy to recommend doing nothing about threats of violence when you’re not the person being victimised. But it really isn’t realistic to expect everyone to be Gandhi or Buddha and for the problem to magically disappear.
[quote=“Elusis, post:227, topic:39970”]Otherwise, you’re just playing “let’s pretend” and trying to demand that your fantasy life serve as the boundaries of the discussion.[/quote]I’m not demanding anything, thanks. You’re right, I don’t spend any time in the kind of places where people fantasize about George Lucas dying a horrible death, and I would prefer to believe they don’t exist. But I’ve seen enough Internet commentary that I don’t think it’s remotely unreasonable to suggest that there are people who find death threats and suchlike are an acceptable substitute for reasoned debate. I think it’s already been mentioned that there have been game developers on the receiving ends of “death threats” several times already; also, “George Lucas Raped My Childhood” was practically a meme for a while, and that’s just the sort of thing that leaks out onto the mainstream.
(This is not to say that there is no such thing as people who make death threats who actually have some interest in following them up. I also don’t think it’s unreasonable to say that there is no shortage of crazy people, even though I don’t personally know anyone that crazy.)
Also, it took me less than a minute to find a video called “I Wanna F*ck Ann Coulter”. I wasn’t even trying very hard. Of course I had no interest in actually watching it.
Changing the culture is spot on. I’m using the “don’t be that dude” and “don’t be silent” ideas used by the anti domestic violence groups here in Oz.
I have a classroom of teenage boys - if I can help them to call out and ostracize people who do this crap or stop them from doing it (some of them are already on the Dark Path of Trolldom) then it’s got to help influence their friends etc. etc.
We might get safer, better gaming spaces some day.
I have seen claims that he’s gotten death threats, as has anyone who has ever made a fan film that was critical of Star Wars.
It wouldn’t surprise me. Lucas made one of the most influential movies of the 20th Century. Of course it’s going to attract loonies. I mean, hell, if a schizophrenic ex-Marine killed Dimebag Darrell for allegedly stealing his songs, why would it be hard to believe that Lucas has gotten threats? The difference here is that he doesn’t publicize it, likely so that the person doesn’t get the fame they think they deserve.
You guys can keep asserting that something equivalent MUST be happening to [insert your favorite hobbyhorse here], and then implying that Sarkeesian* is therefore exaggerating what is happening to her, or is exceptionally thin-skinned in her reaction.
But that doesn’t make it true. The burden of proof is on you guys, so put up or shut up. “I have seen claims…” or “I bet that…” does not constitute proof, and is just a fairly transparent attempt to draw a false equivalence and shift the topic of conversation to Sarkeesian’s character rather than the character and actions of her harassers.
*It really frosts my bacon that when talking about a public woman, people of all stripes often default to using her first name. Calling her “Anita” is just another snarky way to condescendingly imply that she’s not a grown-up or a professional; “she’s just this girl, you know?”
