Which in turn gives rise to the disputed quote (John Steinbeck? Ronald Wright? Emerged from the aether and was randomly attributed?) “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat, but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”
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Who’d have thunk it? It’s illegal to kill a black bear in Texas.
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Hmm, Jerry claimed that he was exploring the consequences of such a society for the sake of the story (that is, seriously examining the idea, as opposed to proposing it). It had its prophetic moments: it foreshadowed the suicide nets on the FoxConn building, for instance.
Would Jerry have seriously proposed such an idea? Hell, yes, but he always hid behind “for the sake of the story.” Unlike Ayn Rand, who thought she was one of her cardboard characters.
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We need libertarianism to prevent exactly this sort of state overreach!
(/s, natch)
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Support the right to arm bears, man!
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Well they (Libtards*, sorry, libertarians…) could build pig toilets but I think they would consider themselves above this kind of endeavour.
So, libertarianism, like communism, is nice and shiny in theory, but in practice its the same as what lies on the bottom of pig toilet, albeit way less useful.
- I always found it funny that some Republicans would consider themselves Libertarians since a republic is one form of government inherited partly from the Romans – then again the Romans built their state on slave labor. I always use the derogative term Liberté-à-rien in Quebec French, term that I coined myself to stand both for the fact that they seem to think that freedom arises without any effort, from entitlement AND that they seem to be screaming and shouting for liberty and freedom even though they themselves do nothing concrete to defend or fight for it.
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I didn’t know that Texas actually had any left. Good to see that they’re protected; they’re surely rare down that way.
I was surprised to see the extensive discussion of dear feeders on the linked page. Up here, it’s illegal for hunters to use bait for deer, bear, waterfowl or turkeys.
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After earning a libertarian reputation in the right (wrong?) circles, I was personally invited to move early on (around 2003-2004) as part of the Free State Project. I declined because while it was fun to blast people on forums, I sure as hell didn’t want any of those A-holes as neighbors. (also, liked my paycheck and changing my location for a cut in salary to support some vague cause didn’t sound very Capitalist to me)
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No doubt Niven&Pournelle are much better writers than Rand, and perhaps you are right that some of the people who read it takes it more seriously than originally intended. “The Moon is a Harsh Mistress” is another book embraced by libertarians for some reason, missing the ending where once free the people on the Moon chose a more conventional government, because if you are not a superman in heavy plot armor you are going to want some protection.
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In many ways its "Got Mine, Want Yours Too, fuck you"
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Personally, I characterize it as “weaponized privilege blindness”. Plenty of poor people are into it, but they have a belief in the world being a meritocracy that only comes from being straight, cis, white, and male.
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While I think these people are idiots, I don’t think they were actually doing much worse than any number of the great anti-state episodes of American Mythology: the pilgrims, the 49ers, the homesteaders etc. Those people were all basically fuckups until the state rolled in behind them to save their asses.
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I once read something saying that Americans and Canadians took opposite lessons from frontier life. Americans learned that you are on your own and must not be dependent on anyone except yourself. Canadians learned that you cannot survive on your own and you have to help your neighbours because one day you will need their help.
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They both agreed on the effectiveness of exploitation and their God given pat on the back for claiming land.
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the book i’m reading: how the south won the civil war* has the premise that arose as part of the legacy of slavery.
government was everywhere: seizing territory from american indians and mexico, the formation of territories and states, laws that restricted who could own property, who could vote, who could testify in court - but it served white men, and especially white wealthy men - to pretend that the west was a level playing field.
just like today: anybody can make it, as long as they are born white, wealthy, and well. for everybody else, and especially the targets of societal racism, good luck
(* hat tip:
Heather Cox Richardson - #936 by Faffenreffer )
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More like LiBEARtarians, amirite?
(stolen from someone more clever than I)
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Or they just claim to be Hoppean libertarians, which can be summarised as the freedom to be a fascist.
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Communism’s problem is that it is usually represented by it’s most authoritarian form, and that form, Marxism-Leninism, has a habit of purging less authoritarian and libertarian (in it’s original, left wing, meaning) forms. This might also be part of the reason why people can’t get their head around the idea of libertarian-socialism.
Bakunin was right.
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Isn’t that basically want most Anarchists want? ‘No government, just community’. In the sense that both Libertarians and Anarchists are anti-authoritarian, but with a right- and left-wing slant respectively.
