Mumia Abu Jamal on science fiction, Star Wars, Star Trek and American imperialism

You asked for “a few choice examples of overwhelming evidence” and specified you’d be most convinced by “physical or recorded evidence” I then provided you with exactly that.

Sure, and I linked to some evidence calling the strength of that evidence into question, not denying that the evidence existed. Certainly the evidence you cited should make us somewhat more inclined to think Mumia did it, my point was just that it may not be a good candidate for the kind of “overwhelming evidence” that Professor59 was talking about.

In the criminal trial, yes. In the civil trial, O.J. was found liable for the wrongful death of and battery against Ronald Goldman, and battery against Nicole Brown.

Do you think this is relevant to why Professor59 made that comment about OJ? Again, from the context it seems he/she was talking about whether OJ actually committed the crime, independent of legal judgments. People are capable of rationally evaluating the strength of evidence for who committed a crime independent of what was decided by the legal system, no? (For example, do you think that since OJ wasn’t found liable for Nicole Brown’s death but only for her battery, there can be no good basis for believing he very likely killed her?)

I didn’t call you or anybody else names.

“Name-calling” can refer to arguments as well as people. Referring to certain arguments as “asinine, prevaricating dissembling and stridently absurd protestations” is not a rational counter-argument, and it does not identify any actual flaw in the argument/evidence being put forward.

The burden of proof is on the writer of that heavily biased essay of dissembling irrelevance.

The writer provided what I thought was reasonable evidence that the prosecution’s ballistics case was not that strong. If we are interested in making our own rational judgments as to the likelihood Mumia did it, it’s not rational to refuse to consider any evidence that goes against the prosecution’s case short of definitive “proof” of his innocence (I would say rationally evaluating evidence basically comes down to an informal version of Bayesian inference, where instead of definitively putting yourself on the “side” of any particular hypothesis, you assign subjective senses of the probabilities of different hypotheses and try to fairly update these probabilities in light of each new piece of evidence or argument). But perhaps you are not interested in rational weighing of evidence pro and con, but just making a rhetorical case.

(Also, on the subject of George Fassnacht, please see the edit I made to my previous comment, made while you were writing this one)

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You didn’t link to evidence; you linked to an essay of opinions which contains no proof of anything except the author’s failure to read the court transcripts, failure to read the findings of the experts, failure to understand them, or refusal to accept what they actually say.

Certainly the evidence you cited should make us somewhat more inclined to think Mumia did it

The evidence I cited was presented at the trial and helped convince twelve jurors Mr. Abu-Jamal killed Officer Faulkner.

The writer provided what I thought was reasonable evidence

She provided no evidence at all, only her own biases and opinions.

The evidence took the form of quoting the written findings of experts prior to the trial in order to show they were less conclusive than what the prosecution witnesses asserted in court. Have you in fact read the police ballistics report, and the Firearms Identification Unit report, and found that her summary and quotes of what they said were inaccurate?

Also, you didn’t address my broad question of whether you think we should automatically take legal decisions as the last word when forming our own opinions as to the likelihood of guilt/innocence, or whether you agree with my statement that “People are capable of rationally evaluating the strength of evidence for who committed a crime independent of what was decided by the legal system” (for example, we can have a rational basis for thinking OJ most likely killed Nicole even though neither the criminal nor the civil trial found him guilty of this) If you do agree, then you can’t say that “refusal to accept” what the prosecution experts said is automatically a bad judgment, especially if documents produced by other experts, like the ballistics report, don’t support the prosecution experts’ confidence.

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Likely the result of jury nullification (a principle which I support by the way) - to say “OJ was found not guilty” is not the same thing as to say “OJ did not kill her”.

Shouldn’t we talking about how the States are now the Empire instead of the Rebellion?

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I think you’re confused about jury nullification (or I am).

O.J. was acquitted because the prosecution did not prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt. So it wasn’t “He didn’t do it,” but “We’re not certain enough that he did it.”

Jury nullification, on the other hand, is, “We’re quite certain he did what he was accused of, but we don’t approve of punishing him for it.”

I don’t think anyone is saying that the jury believed Simpson was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but chose to acquit because they thought his actions shouldn’t be punished.

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Are you crazy? We have a rehash his trial, because reasons…

Luke Skywalker, the rebels, Vader, and the empire all representing the USA is one of the smartest things I’ve ever heard about Star Wars.

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