Wealthy Dems and their backers hate Bernie (and Warren) for the same reason they hated Kucinich: he wants to tax the rich

The United States needs to cut its emissions regardless of what Nigeria does. And our emissions are much higher than Nigeria.

Also, there is such a thing as SMRs. A company called NuScale has a design for a reactor that can be built in a factory and installed at a lower cost. These reactors could be exported to a place like Nigeria. And there are also Chinese companies working on the same type of thing.

I agree with you that we desperately need improved storage battery technology.

It’s going to be very sad when people have to blame something other than Wealthy Dems or Bitter Hillary supporters for why non-centrist nominees didn’t succeed.

There might actually be other reasons for Dems, wealthy or not, for not wanting to back Sanders. And, really, if Wealthy Dems’ laser-focus was on Sanders’ “Taxing The Rich,” they wouldn’t be Wealthy Dems, they’d be Wealthy Republicans.

We need a centrist candidate, under the age of 60, as the nominee. (Bernie is 78.5 on Inauguration day, ffs.) And s/he will be a great nominee if you are a Sanders supporter. 90% of Sander’s policy initiatives are now the status quo of the Democratic party.

See, that’s a problem, though. Yes, you will vote for Sanders, so will I. But getting grudging votes is not how you win. Everything leading up to the vote – campaign working, getting out the vote, making phonecalls, social media, being motivated for your candidate – is what generates momentum and turnout. How many Sanders campaign workers helped Hillary in the general election? How many Hillary supporters are going to volunteer for Sanders? Then, look at how Reagan motivated Republicans, how Obama motivated Democrats. That’s how you win. Right now, the person I think could win is Buttigieg: when I hear him and see the impression he makes, I’m reminded of the effect Obama had when he first came to everyone’s attention.

Only Bernie/Warren recognize climate change? You sure about that? Jay Inslee’s entire campaign is focused on climate change.

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I am no lover of Bernie Sanders, and I would hate to vote for him to occupy the Oval Office. (And no, @doctorow, not because I am scared of paying higher taxes.) But if it came down to Trump vs. Bernie, I would absolutely go to the polling place and pull the lever for Bernie. I think he’s wrong about a whole lot of things, but I suspect he would also work toward reducing climate change even if not by the means you prefer. Bernie voters, in general, are all about letting the perfect be the enemy of the good. @brant , don’t be like them.

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Centrist democrat = climate catastrophe. We don’t have the time to fuck about with this anymore.

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I guess I have seen a lot of people on the right voting for politicians who have agendas in direct opposition to their constituents’ interest (health care, cutting entitlements, etc.) but I can’t think of examples on the left… but I may be blinded by my own biases.

The easiest example is the one Cory alludes to in the article–democratic candidates are generally okay with increasing taxes, and yet well-off (and even rich) people vote for democratic candidates all the time. The decision may be in their larger interest or may speak to other interests, but when viewing just the one narrow interest in keeping one’s money, it’s a vote against that interest.

And it’s presumably the same for republican voters. Poor or middle-class republicans may have their own interests in financial security damaged by voting for a republican candidate, but they may make the calculation that other concerns (limiting immigration, making sure government doesn’t interfere with what they view as their religious prerogatives) are more important.

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Obviously. Nominating Sanders would be a disaster from the perspective of engaging the majority of voters who went for Clinton last time around. I would probably swallow my pride and donate and volunteer for him in the general if that’s what it took because Trump is unleashing a multigenerational cancer on government that we may never actually recover from, but my friends who’ve had the displeasure of actually having to work with Bernie, and who were enthusiastic Clinton volunteers last time around, probably wouldn’t.

And the problem is twofold, because the people who actually do enthusiastically support Bernie have demonstrated that they are adept at shoving away otherwise simpatico voters with great force.

He bears watching for sure. He’s talented, personable, and charismatic. But I think it’s a bit of a red flag that his web site does not have any articulated policy proposals.

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A big conservative talking point I keep seeing in comments elsewhere is that progressive DEMs like Bernie/Warren etc. are hypocrites or liars, because they have lots of money while pushing for programs that would benefit the poor.

The logic around that one is so twisted.

I guess only the poor should push for programs that benefit them, and so the poor should run for office? (Except obviously you can’t make a realistic run for office if you’re poor.)

So then, even if you agree with Bernie on the issues you shouldn’t vote for him, and should vote for Trump because he’s exactly what he appears to be: a craven greedy lying crook? (Basically, when conservatives gripe about how much money Bernie or Warren make they’re really just trying screw with the opposition, it’s not a legitimate issue at all.)

Hmmm. How much FNC shows are dying is up for debate (I hear stories about their ratings falling all the time, and yet they’re still here), but I doubt Bernie and Buttigieg appearing on their shows makes any difference there. You can’t complain FNC is one-sided, while at the same time get angry when they DO feature progressive ideas via Bernie/Buttigieg. Having someone like Bernie on is really just sneaking progressive ideas into their viewers psyches. It’s a trade-off.

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Obama was more popular than Clinton, and Clinton was more popular than Sanders.

I don’t know how a person can get from that, to Sanders being as popular as Obama.

It would be great if I’m wrong about that, but I’m not seeing it now.

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There are positions outside the Democrat-Republican spectrum. The closest I have to an ideal candidate has no interest in running for traditional political positions. Everyone is a compromise

The democratic status quo is not doing anywhere near enough. I’d prefer it if things didn’t get so bad that we need primitivism to fix the environment.

Does Jay Inslee have an actual manifesto yet? His campaign site seemed to be lacking in-depth information.

ETA: since I think I need to do this again

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We’re also still over 18 months out with an extremely crowded field of hopefuls. I just want people to ignore polls and get out to vote. And coverage seems to have a cooling effect on that.

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…Does Cory realize Kucinich is now a Fox News pundit?

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I’m afraid you are simply trading one ecological disaster for another. There is no safe way to store nuclear waste and we have already had a few spectacular nuclear power disasters.

No wind, solar, hydro, or geothermal power plant has failed in a way to make it uninhabitable for the next several hundred years. Please explain how nuclear is safer than wind or solar.

And where do we store it where we know it’s contained? Where is the nuclear waste storage facility that can safely handle the waste for 15.7 million years without crumbling into a toxic wasteland within the first 1000 years?

Let’s not punt the problem down the road for a future generation to deal with. I’ve seen enough of that from the Boomers. Instead, let’s use free, renewable, and safe energy sources.

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Oh boy, where to begin?..

  1. Obama went on not as a candidate, but as president. Apples & oranges. He wasn’t trying to win votes.
  2. Other candidates are going on Fox News, just like other candidates are copying Bernie’s positions - which were all called “wacky” “commie” “insane” just a few years ago. Yes, it’s copying Bernie’s success, and trying to coopt his votes. TPTB do not want Bernie in as president. They’re much much prefer a neolib like most of the other Democrats that are running.

I understand that claming its copying is a judgement call. So its just my opinion, But others think the same way; plus the undeniable fact that his policies were being ridiculed just a few years ago by Dems. Now suddenly they all want the same kind of things.

Here is a link (if you get too angry after looking at it … it’s satire … but satire grounded in reality like all good satire is)

As for “ather let Trump burn the world down if you can’t get what you want”, it seems that historical political knowledge is in short supply these days … the PUMA phenomenon seems to be swept under the rug:

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It’s all in the timing, and the fact of the immense hatred that TPTB have for Sanders. He is the only one they’re scared of - the same kind of fear that led TPTB to seriously attempt a coup on FDR in 1936. I’ll add Tulsi [with the caveat that she’s a member of the CFR] and maybe Warren [since she was a registered Republican for many years] to candidates they hate.

This hatred has led to their latest strategy, which is to run dozens of candidates, to dilute Sander’s votes. If they can’t knock him out in the primaries, there might be no clear winner on the 1st ballot at the convention. This would lead to a 2nd ballot. The new rules that the DNC put in allow democracy (letting the people choose who they want) only on the 1st ballot. After that, it’s back to the “smoke filled room” method of selecting which puppet, ooops, I mean candidate to let Americans vote for.

Non sequitur: n. a statement (such as a response) that does not follow logically from or is not clearly related to anything previously said.

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Very ironic comment.

The regulatory scheme for nuclear energy was recently overhauled by the passage of the Nuclear Energy Innovation and Modernization Act. We have Small Modular Reactor (SMR) designs from companies like NuScale that can be built in factories and deployed quickly. And we have competition from Russian and Chinese companies that are building new reactors both for domestic use and export. The DOE seems to be concerned about the US moving too slowly and allowing countries to fall under China or Russia influence on nuclear energy. Whoever sells them the reactor will be providing service, selling the fuel, and taking away the used fuel for reprocessing or storage. There is a lot going on in the American nuclear industry to try to catch up. But because the President has so much power, a President Sanders could torpedo the whole thing for a generation. That’s why I feel like it is vitally important to stop him.

If you like his social policies (as I do), i implore you to consider supporting Andrew Yang or Jay Inslee instead.

That is not right. Cory Booker is definitely a centrist candidate who takes climate change seriously. I am donating to his campaign every month because of his position on climate change and nuclear power.

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