Woman who documented sexual harassment receives rape threats


#22

I think this is an important point. I see a lot of people saying “what’s the big deal, most of the comments weren’t that rude”?

Unless you live in a small town where everyone says hi to every other person in the street, the norm in a big city is TO NOT ADDRESS STRANGERS. This is not a rudeness issue. It’s a scale issue. You can’t acknowledge everyone. So acknowledge nobody.

Now imagine walking down a crowded street and having every tenth person say something to you. Even ignoring that takes effort. We’re social animals and we are socialized to not simply ignore people. Therefore, by simply addressing someone you are asking something of them.

I guarantee nobody would want to have to deal with being addressed AT ALL by every tenth person on a crowded street. Now imagine if some of that was rude or implicitly (or explicitly) threatening.


#23

You are in a position to help stop it. You can use your influence to change the culture you live in so that it is less tolerant of this kind of harassment. Culture sustains the practice of harassment, and culture can destroy it.

This is maybe less direct or satisfying than you’d prefer, but if you really actually want to stop harassment, you’ll have to find a way to work with what’s available.

The point of all these threads is to get folks like you to move from “this is unfortunate, but I can’t think of anything convenient and/or comfortable that I could do about it, so meh” to “OK, that’s it. This is simply unacceptable, and I will do what it takes to stop it, even if that’s inconvenient and/or uncomfortable”.


#24

Same problem for trans people, disabled people, openly gay people, and on, and on!

This sort of shit happens every day, everywhere.

Just cos some commenter has never personally experienced it invalidates it? Bullshit!

Try switching on a bit of fucking empathy!!


#25

I think the point is to rally to the cause. To call attention. To garner momentum. It might seem like a dead horse but the more repeated attention is called to it, the more possibility there is of an actual impact in aggregate.


#26

Even if she had been “parading herself” I can’t think of many circumstances in which it’s appropriate to yell out catcalls during a parade. (Possibly Mardi Gras in New Orleans, but only in very specific circumstances and when a fair exchange in beads are involved.)


#27

She’s an attractive woman, right?

So, in an optimal culture, what she’d be attracting would be attentions she’d like to receive. And if someone mistakenly offered attention she didn’t want, one or both parties could politely communicate their lack of mutual attraction and all would be well. Right?

Hey, that’s what seems to happen in places where I like to hang out. People can dress in as much or as little as they want, and walk wherever they want, and other people can express interest, appreciation or sexual availability without being insulting, and people can tell other people they aren’t interested in further interactions without anyone getting upset.

But apparently in New York City, it ain’t like that. On the Internet, it’s not necessarily like that. And apparently on Twitter, it’s REALLY REALLY not like that.

So, at what point do people need to just leave these places and go somewhere with a more optimal culture? Shouldn’t we just shut twitter down if it’s a toxic, harmful environment?


#28

Not being a twitter user I can’t say for sure but I suspect it’s a small proportion of actual users who are toxic. This is akin to saying “Some people are dicks, therefore let’s blow up the world.”


#29

So an hour ago you didn’t realise this was an issue, now you know about it, but don’t see why you should or even why it should have been raised as an issue at all.

Can you see the point of being involved in a discussion about how you feel powerless to affect the issue that you were unaware of until an hour ago?


#30

As an introvert I can’t even fathom being addressed by people constantly in the street – EVEN IF THEY WERE SUPER POLITE. Women are put in a position of either having to converse with every tenth person in the street or choose to ignore people. Either way they lose. If they choose to deal with every person then they wouldn’t get anywhere and they’d be dealing non-stop. That’s exhausting. If they ignore they’re being rude (not by choice). Ignoring another person isn’t considered polite. And I can imagine simply ignoring a person takes a toll even if the person doesn’t do anything else.


#31

New Zealand PSA:


#32

So if I’m reading you right, you’re saying a woman simply walking down the street shouldn’t get upset by all these male “expressions of interest”?

Cuz if that’s what you’re saying, I thoroughly disagree, and your blindness – to how what a man can think of as a mere compliment can actually come across in many contexts to a woman as a threat, and as a rude intrusion at best – is pretty sad.


#33

Well, I’m not sure at what point that the rubber would hit the road on that, but, frankly, look at how this exchange has played out. It took till your reply for the response to even be civil, let alone something like a suggestion on what to do. It’s not a matter of what I prefer, or what’s satisfying, but, when good meaning people simply don’t see how they’d have an opportunity to help, either directly or in being involved in a discussion, and they’re greeted with A) insulting condescension, followed by B)Accusations of willful blindness due to privilege, and pretty much virtually spat at, How exactly do folks on here think they’re going to get supporters from the ranks of those who don’t have this as their primary interest, but might otherwise be open to support, if a bit unsure on how? I know I’m speaking more to others than you @zikzak, but, it seems yours is the first calm, non pre-pissed voice in here.

The phrase catch more flies with honey than vinegar seems like it might apply here.


#34

My bingo card is nearly full.


#35

No, because, frankly, if I’d not done 2 months being desensitized to abuse by being screamed at by an Airforce MTI, I’m sure I would have split by now. And there have been others on other threads, asking well meaning questions who just got shit on, who did leave. Is that really helping any useful cause?


#36

That’s the point of this demonstration. But hey, enjoy the privilege of sexual harassment-free sleepwalking to your theater-grunt job, although I get the distinct impression you’d be less inclined to dismiss this if someone you love has been on the receiving end of incessant, disgusting harassment. FYI: They have.


#37

I have a different perspective on all of this stuff.

I think people have a peculiar sweet tooth for seeing society as being toxic. New-agey movement that has the profound sense that “science” is a biological and psychological poison. Insular cultures believe that other cultures and peoples are to be kept out of their utopia. Scientologists believe that

Basically, today’s vapid quazi-feminist movement sees men and women as clones. In this particular society-is-sick iteration, any instances of gender differences in outcome is evidence of discrimination. Since there will, at least over the span of evolutionary time, always be gender differences and therefore different gender outcomes, it’s the gift that will keep on giving to those who get a charge from the belief that society is sick.

The trope that’s become in vogue these days is that we’re living in a “rape culture”. This is the shark-jumping moment. It’s taken the ugliest word and the most heinous deed and applied it to the broadest possible scope of human interaction. Really: this is a rape culture. That’s the tenor and intensity of emotion that accompanies this particular brand of the age-old psychological impulse to see society as sick, and even threatening.

As one of innumerable gifts that keeps on giving, any jackass can say brain-dead and aggressive stuff on a YouTube video. When it happens, it creates the opportunity to say, and truly believe:

“Rape and death threats have become a standard response to any woman who dares to speak out on the internet about, well, anything.”

Why is that little word “a” not unpacked? Is it too many syllables to specify that it is (and not “has become”) the standard response by jackasses, who indeed exist? No, I think that that little vowel illustrates our sweet tooth to see society as sick.

The levels of conflation and plain-old exaggeration are myriad. Greeting beautiful women is not just impolite, or lacking in tact. It’s aggression toward women. Appealing to boys by depicting women in their prototypical beautiful physical form is an insult to women. It’s not deliberate deception; it’s quite genuine sentiment. But it’s meant to move the needle perception that society is sick. To feed the sweet tooth.

My metaphor quota for the week is now full.


1980 D&D ad asserts that RPGs are woman-friendly
#38

Your mileage may vary, but I find this doesn’t happen very often when you don’t start out by declaring an issue affecting someone else a dead horse and questioning whether there is any point in talking about it.


#39

OK, your feelings have been a little hurt by the unwelcome reception your comments have got.

My sympathy for your position is undercut somewhat by your lack of sympathy for the woman getting the rape threats for wanting to walk down the street without harassment, an issue you brush aside.

Perhaps part of the usefulness of a thread like this is that people can express their solidarity with others who are experiencing oppression, without necessarily sinking into some kind of nihilistic existential quagmire about their own capacity to single handedly fix society.


#40

Your privileged appropriation of the mantle of victimhood is duly noted.

I feel so, so sorry for you!

There. Do you feel better now?


#41

We have a long way to go as evidenced by the fact that so many people don’t even understand that there is a problem.