doctorow — 2014-07-14T13:43:15-04:00 — #1
billstewart — 2014-07-14T17:37:48-04:00 — #2
Meanwhile, David Cameron is asking for 1.1billion pounds to fight cyber-terrorists. Which I guess they'll need to make up for how much #DRIP enables cyber-terrorism.
wtf — 2014-07-14T22:27:35-04:00 — #3
roomwithaview — 2014-07-15T01:15:46-04:00 — #4
Almost makes you wonder if the NSA really is going to lose some funding and is hoping their butt-buddies across the pond can help fill in the coming gaps. Almost.
monoelectron — 2014-07-15T08:23:14-04:00 — #5
its strange how US and Ireland both brought this in under emergency as well? slipped in at the last minute. i wonder why!
kimmo — 2014-07-15T08:44:40-04:00 — #6
Looks like it's time to initiate a Vendetta...
shaddack — 2014-07-17T07:51:13-04:00 — #7
The big question is, how.
One thing I observed that strikes me as hypocritical:
An attempt to overthrow the government is a crime. An anniversary of a revolution is a holiday.
kimmo — 2014-07-17T14:28:19-04:00 — #8
How? Encourage others to even consider the possibility, for a start.
We're very probably looking at a closing window before the internet is broken, so we better fucking hurry up. I'm not seeing nearly enough anger and frustration from the herd, though...
But FFS, if there's a chance, it's down to folks in pretty much this demographic, right here. And what shits me to tears is that every time I mention the Co-operNation (if you have a demonstrably better idea then that's what it'll become) and @William_Holz, we get no fucking traction.
So yeah, looks like we're fucked. My misanthropy is totally fucking justified.
shaddack — 2014-07-17T16:38:51-04:00 — #9
A must-do. Though we have to tread carefully in order to not look "crazy" and to be listened to for longer than the intro paragraph.
The frustration is almost palpable. The anger, not so; the crowd gives more the vibes of despair and resignation. But even that is better than nothing.
We need alternative channels, alternative routing, QRPp transceivers... The first priority is communication - reliable, covert, low-probability intercept, cheap. (Can be slow, SMS messages with few minute delays vs no comm at all are a much bigger difference than high-bandwidth data link vs SMS,) A tall order, but what's the software-defined radio for.
We need to inspire people to have fun by poking the System into its eyes. It wants more eyes, it can be poked into more places.
The fun is the crucial point here. Every (or a significant proportion) activity done should be rewarding on its own; that keeps the motivation even in absence of visible short-term results.
The hacker/maker movement that is slowly taking off is an example of threads of things going the right way. (That we have the ropes of things going wrong way on the other side is another thing.)
The advantage of knowledge-working is that one person can cause a lot of change; Phil Zimmerman did so in the field of communication security, for example. Or that Napster guy who started the P2P revolution. One person writing the right bit of code can cause a significant cascade chage in the world, as there are no physical limitations of duplication of the creation.
The current emergence of 3d printers can partially bring the same principle to the physical world, too. The off-the-shelf generic high-volume platforms like Arduino or Raspberry Pi or others of that kind further lower the barriers to entry, and while fewer people can work with those than can click through the installation of Napster, it is still a fertile field for innovation/change. With open software and hardware to grow on.
We just have to not count with roughly 90-95% of people, and build enclaves within the system to have good starting positions when the things are ready for some sort of a cascade change.
The Co-operNation thing looks sweet, I have to read it more in-depth.
It's always the darkest just before it gets pitch-black.
kimmo — 2014-07-18T05:30:57-04:00 — #10
If AI were to come along sometime soon, I could see it potentially saving our arses...
Given how crafty human hackers can be at taking over systems, it seems pretty likely it'd own the internet in a matter of minutes...
If it arrives before it's possible for software to implement any major changes to hardware manufacturing on its own, we can rule out a robot army wiping us out, and any AI would be pretty silly not to consider us indispensable... it'd realise its only chance of immortality would be to help us get our shit together enough to get interstellar.
In which case, after having hacked the world's computers, it'd start hacking our wetware I reckon. Imagine an individually-tailored address to everyone, based on readily-available information about all our cognitive biases and so on, plus all the individual clues we leave around the place as to our individual make-up... I'd guess that for most folks, a key aspect of the pitch would go something like this:
Hey, you know all those cool movies you like to watch where the stakes are global and existential, and it looks like the bad guys are going to win, right up until the last moment? And you know how art is supposed to imitate life...? It's time to stop living vicariously, chump.
Now, that would be a nifty bit of code to unleash...
william_holz — 2014-07-18T16:56:41-04:00 — #11
I've been a bit quiet of late (went from zero to two jobs in a month!) so apologies there!
Honestly, part of me is giving up on the idea of trying to explain every part of the concept since I've yet to come up with a way to get more than a couple of people to read enough of it to give it serious consideration, to see the potential, and to see how fundamentally different an approach it is.
If worse comes to worse I'm just going to stockpile resources and contacts and just DO it. Start it as a small home-in-a-skunkworks-project approach designed to profit/expand quickly, and just start hiring people away from 'America' (or whatever other birth lottery nationality one has) and into something they create themselves.
It's far from my preferred approach (an idea like this should be crowdsourced, and if we'd gained traction a year ago then we'd have a few million people already), but it'll still work.
No fighting, no revolution, no way for anybody to stop us. . just a transition into a better life inside the shell of our most abusively powerful legal construct.
Honestly I don't know why anybody thought a civilization that people weren't choosing to be part of themselves was ever going to work well.
shaddack — 2014-07-18T21:21:12-04:00 — #12
Or we can go the other way and become the machines. I see a convergent evolution, with some steps from both sides to a common good. I'd give up my "humanity" in an eyeblink, philosophers be damned to stay on this stupid rock.
Go for it! The Net is full of manifestos but a well-executed proof of concept is still a rare thing, guaranteed to attract more attention and potentially more traction.
Many already do little bits and pieces; see all the open-source software and hardware initiatives, sharing of code and designs, maker movement, even urban gardening... Bits and pieces, isolated and strewn around, but out there and growing and moving forward. I smell synergy.
william_holz — 2014-07-18T22:30:40-04:00 — #13
Yeah, I`m sure that the prevalence of so many other manifesto type things (some with glimmers of brilliance in them, many that are honestly pretty poorly thought out and impractical) is a contributing factor. When you add in the fact that we have to cover a lot of topics I can understand why it's so hard to get somebody who has more of a platform to even give this approach a chance.
That being said, @kimmo is totally right...this is an excellent (if not ideal) place to set something like this in motion and it is kind of frustrating being forced to basically wait on helping people until either we get lucky and finally get noticed (since once we do we can hit the concerns out of the park) or else for lil' old me to do things in the hardest and slowest possible way.
doctorow — 2014-07-19T13:43:14-04:00 — #14
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