9 dead in gun massacre at church


#1

[Read the post]


#2

If what some people do is easy to label “terrorism,” but this mass-shooting isn’t, then ______________.


#3

Of course it was terrorism. White violence meant to support white supremacy has always been terrorism. [ETA] White violence against the black community was the original terrorism, actually.


#4

Actually, no. Things apparently go to the 1st century AD and probably far beyond that.


#5

This scum proudly wore flags of the colonial era on his jacket, Rhodesia and apartheid South Africa:

He sat there for like an hour in a bible study group before opening fire…


#6

Roger that. Maybe I should have said,

If so many people so quickly label what some people “terrorism,” but they don’t do so with this mass-shooting, then ______________.


#7

in America, they were the original terrorists.

This was a hate crime, killing 9 people for having the “wrong” color skin. how about we leave the pendantic shit at the door, okay.


#9

Or it was yet another case of somebody not getting the psychiatric care they should’ve received long ago. Sometimes the hate is a symptom, not the root cause.

Too early to say now.


#10

Oh, there has already been people denying it was a hate crime, when DUDE HAS THE FLAGS OF TWO WHITE SUPREMACIST COUNTRY ON HIS FUCKING JACKET… so yeah, despite it being an act of hate and terrorism, it will be bandied about as a “lone wolf”, not representative of something larger, etc.

I grew up around assholes like this scum (not too many, but more than one is more than enough), and they get this shit from somewhere. They are part of an interconnected group and have been for a long time. They’ve all read their tattered copy of William Pierce’s Turner Diaries, and have a nice collection of albums from Resistance Records. They think they are cutting edge rebels and are right.


#11

Read my comment to @milliefink. I grew up around assholes like this. I know how they think. And if this was a Muslim, no one would think twice about calling him a hateful terrorist, so please, just stop with this. If you want to have your only brown skin guys are terrorists narrative affirmed, this is not the place.

You don’t wear Rhodesia’s flag on your jacket cause it’s pretty, you wear it because you are a committed white supremacist:


#12

Or it was yet another case of somebody not getting the psychiatric care they should’ve received long ago. Sometimes the hate is a symptom, not the root cause.

Problem is, that gets said so quickly about white (supremacist) mass killers, and almost never about other ones.


#13

Just came here to mention that.

I’m also reminded of all the Confederate flags on the gravestones at the nearby Magnolia Cemetary.

I know this church - or where it is, at least. Walked past it last time I was in Charleston, there was a wedding party going on there.


#14

My grandmother’s cousin reconsecrated some Confederate graves at her church a few years back. It was in the local paper, with pictures of my grandparents. Ugh. And many states here in the south still celebrate confederate memorial day.


#15

And many states here in the south still celebrate confederate memorial day.

It’ll be interesting to see if SC flies that awful flag at half mast. Or just puts it away for at least a day (not holding my breath).


#16

Black men and women murdered by police are called thugs. A white man murders 9 black people and (white) people call him mentally ill.


#17

Of course they will, because he was a crazy lone wolf, not a terrorist out to kill black people. And the flag’s about history, not about hate… /s


#18

Terrorism is still terrorism and hate crimes are still hate crimes when committed by a mentally ill person.

In fact, I’d be surprised if the rate of psychosis among suicide bombers wasn’t much higher than in the general population.

Identifying the act as a hate crime and/or as a terrorist act is completely legitimate regardless of the mental health of the perpetrator. It’s too simple to say the hate is a “symptom” – perhaps mental illness makes some more prone to adopting fringe ideologies, but the ideology itself is still likely a major causal factor. The vast majority of mentally ill folks don’t go around shooting up prayer groups.

Serious question: if we had in hand incontrovertible evidence that the 9/11 perpetrators were all mentally ill, would you respond the same way you have here? That those appx. 20 young Muslim men simply didn’t receive the psychiatric care, and that their hate could simply be a symptom, not the root cause?


#19

or because you wanna be one.


#20

One of my most odd memories of visiting Oxford Mississippi was as the wife and I were walking to Faulkner’s house. A very nice gentleman out working on his lawn once he found out I was from Missouri was all happy to point out which houses were and were not burned down by The Yankees. I guess from a historic point of view it was nice but I just got the feeling of ‘really, dude, the war ended long before your dad was alive, yes you lost, get over it’. I find it sad that humans can harbor such feelings over stuff that didn’t even happen to them directly.

But yeah this was terrorism. This guy may be a lone wolf nutcase but his reason for doing it was to cause fear and terror at the target population and if that does not count I don’t know what does.


#21

No, white supremacists have an ideological stance of white supremacy. This dude is a white supremacist. He’s not mentally ill, or confused, or whatever. He’s a hate-filled loser.