Is it the white, non-muslim actors or the homoerotic subtext that’s going to offend? And will this offend every Muslim or just the white, gay ones?
But also… Rumi was old when he did a lot of his major work. There was also some heavy old-fashioned homosuggestive bromancing going on. I’m not saying they don’t have range and that they’re spring chickens, but RDJ and DiCaprio leave me scratching my head a little. They’re not exactly right for the role based on previous work. Here’s the other thing: It’s about fucking RUMI! Who the fuck do they think the audience is? Marvel fanboys?
It’s a little like Zoey Seldana being picked for the Nina Simone role. I’m not so eager to go around with color swatches trying to figure out how black someone needs to be to play a black character, but goddamn, is Zooey Seldana not right for the role. Nina Simone had a very healthy helping of attitude that I don’t see her pulling off in a million years.
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Freddie Mercury was from Zanzibar, of Parsi (i.e. Indian Zoroastrian) origin. They migrated to India about a thousand years ago.
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Would be interesting to see just how white the whole production crew is, since if the script is written by someone who has no interest or experience outside mainstream white culture then there will be problems from the start, add in if the director and producer are very mainstream white centric in their choices then the whole thing will be a flustercluck from start to finish no matter who is cast.
If they used lesser known (in Hollywood) actors and a more ethnically diverse cast the film would not only be more historically accurate, but might actually be made decently on a significantly smaller budget. That would mean it wouldn’t have to make a huge amount to be sucessful.
When they make films like this with huge budgets needed for the stars and they flop because they are badly scripted or cast they tend to blame the theme, nobody wants to see films about (subject) rather than we effed up and whitewashed the cast or had a really crappy script, thereby alienating the core audience who would appreciate the film.
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I am not really one to insist on any particular demographic of actor for any particular role. To me, the point of acting is to portray someone who you are not. I am pretty White, but I do not care about the heritage of actors or filmmakers. Only the quality of the film. Most of my life has been spent in places where I was not in the majority. I am also a huge cinema geek, as are my kids.
In that case, I’m not sure why you’re even bothering to comment in a thread about the problems wrought by clumsy and inaccurate racial and ethnic characterization in Hollywood movies.
Sure, the point of acting is to portray someone who the actor is not, but the problem of Hollywood whitewashing is the many ways in which its films consistently center white people and their perspectives (while shuttling those of others off to the sides, when those of others get any attention at all). So if a film contains a whitened portrayal of non-white experiences, it might still pass for you as a “quality” film, but the inability of others to see their differing experiences represented fairly in it can make it anything but a quality film. Indeed, if you’re white, then a privilege you enjoy is having no trouble at all finding and watching what amounts to representation of the perspectives and experiences of people like you being front-and-centered yet again, almost all the time.
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So you have low expectations, why should those of us who want better, more accurate representation of the source material care about your passive-aggressive lack of interest?
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I do not think that I have low expectations. I love accuracy in historical film, as well as stories told from different perspectives than the conventional. This article started with a bunch of criticism of a film because it was proposed that a historical figure with an Islamic name be portrayed by a White person. It seems to me that many of those people were basing their opinions on stereotypes about what people with Islamic sounding names should look like.
I am generally opposed to any sort of racial hygiene standards for film or anywhere else. For several reasons. To begin with, in order to impose such standards, we would need to define everyone’s race, to determine what they will be allowed to perform, say, or otherwise express. Then we would need to put some group or person in charge of deciding who will be allowed to do what, according to their specific heritage. There seem to be plenty of people who want that job. I don’t like where that leads.
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It’s plenty… odd that you think that there aren’t actors from every particular demographic background to play a role.
You suffer from more than a lack of imagination.
And that person in charge of casting a person of the descent of the role? It’s the casting department. They are in charge of making those decisions. That is what they do.
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What do you know about “people like me”, and my experiences and perspectives? I spent most of my childhood in a coastal fishing village in rural Japan. I have met very few people anywhere who share my perspectives, except for my own children. And even their experience was of urban Tokyo.
You missed my “if.” All I know about you is that in this thread, you’re saying the kinds of things that many ordinary white Americans do. That doesn’t mean I’m sure you are one.
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Well, I am pretty White. you wrote “if you’re white” But that does not define who I am or how I think. Unless you are talking about the social construct of whiteness, because I probably do not fit into that particular box. On the other hand, I do know what it feels like to have people ask to be allowed take a photograph of themselves with my children, which has happened literally hundreds of times. I also know what it is like to go into a restaurant, and have the server refuse to take my order, because “white people do not like that”. But the picture thing does not bother me, because I understand where it comes from.
You’re not demonstrating any responsiveness to what I wrote about what it’s usually like for you to watch the standard depictions of raced characters (white and non-white) in Hollywood movies, as opposed to what it’s usually like for non-white viewers. Pretty common white thing, that.
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I should have addressed that more specifically. I think I understand your point. but the same could be said about depictions of Non Indians in Bollywood films, or non Japanese in Japanese films. Really almost any place that has a film industry. I suppose that as a more multicultural nation, we should be leading the world in realistic depictions of other cultures. But I also think that realistic and compassionate depiction is not just about racial purity. How far do we take it? Is it acceptable for an actor of Philippine descent to play a Japanese character? Or back to the film being discussed, should a person of Arab heritage be allowed to play a Tajik? Should a Christian be permitted to direct a film about the Jewish experience? I think we are crossing over to territory covered by the cultural appropriation people. I have my own views, but I am very interested in listening to the views of others on these subjects, especially if they can be reasonably specific about the rules.
Why is it that whenever change to retrograde and damaging mores and the cultural products that influence them is suggested, someone always jumps up and says, “Wait, how far are we going to take this? This could get really extreme you know!” No one is suggesting censorship or enforced casting decisions. All the voices I’m hearing (and agreeing with) that are suggesting change on this issue are suggesting heightened awareness that can eventually prompt less white-centric casting choices. I’m not interested in hypothetical extremes that supposedly lurk somewhere down some nonexistent slippery slope.
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Would that make you immune to any particular blindness towards attempts to whitewash history?
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Not really. Hiring decisions about A-list leads are made by the producers and the director.
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Nope! If you don’t think it’s funny, fine. But in comedy either everything goes, or nothing goes. And by today’s standards all of the jokes I posted were pretty tame. Go look at some of the comedians that are currently regarded as “the top” and you’ll find stuff that’s way more offensive.
Less white-centric casting choices and more diverse storytelling. Because white-washing isn’t just about casting decisions, it’s also about the amount of available minority roles in movies.
The whole “Oscars so white” thing wasn’t just because so many roles were whitewashed, it was also because most of the roles were white to begin with.
And in the few cases where the roles weren’t white, like in Straight outta Compton, the actors are patted on the back but otherwise ignored when it comes to giving out accolades.
This does not, however, mean that this should be taken to extremes. But, Hollywood does need to get way more diverse in its casting and storytelling before we are actually talking about whether or not they’ve taken it “to the extreme”.
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No, that does not make me special, except in the sense that everyone has a story, which is why stereotyping is bad. The only thing that helps me see history somewhat free from my own preconceptions and cultural biases was the fact that I had a couple of great professors at University who were really great at showing students how to evaluate artifacts and sites within the context of their own time and place.
It is great if we can free history from it’s current position as fictionalized national folklore, and see historical persons and events truthfully. I personally do not see that happening. We seem to be replacing one set of fictions with another. I will try not to waste everyone’s time, but I have a good example. My oldest is in University, and has a professor who is trying to teach the students that warfare, in the context of groups of people trying to kill each other, did not exist until introduced to the world by Europeans. Primitive and tribal societies had ritualized warfare, where few people died. Even the weapons found in ancient graves were “symbolic” items. She is trying to rewrite history to conform with her views about western civilization, despite all the evidence to the contrary.
