Caturday: Survivor Edition

boing
25

And the choices for “something else” are :

a) Do nothing but take a photograph ?
b) Do nothing but feel bad for the cat and wish it luck ?
c) Take matters into your own hands and shoot or poison it “for its own good” so you won’t be bothered by your perception of its suffering ?
d) Call animal control and employees will spend a few hours attempting to trap it by any means possible, to take to the nearest animal control facility where it will remain until it is found by its former owner, adopted or euthanized on the basis of its temperament and condition. When it is euthanized it is literally placed into garbage receptacles and then hauled away en mass and the municipality is charged by weight for the cremation and ash disposal ?
e) Avoid walking around that location so you won’t have to see that cat that makes you feel bad because it is so beat up and sad looking ?

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Thanks for the exhaustive list of alternatives, presented in a neutral and non-moralizing manner. It strikes me that it’s probably a good thing you don’t live in the wilderness where you might encounter all sorts of sick, injured, starving, or otherwise stressed animals.

Why is this relevant, and why should I care what happens to the body? I mean, I don’t care if this happens to me when I’m dead, because my body is just my body. But thanks for once again implying that if our moral choices don’t align exactly with yours that there must be something wrong with us.

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So - what are the “something elses” that you propose as a plan of action, when you see a rough looking cat like the one in the photo, who you understand has been living adjacent to a dumpster and parking lot FOR YEARS ? What do you, bwv812, personally think is a correct, ethical, humane way to respond to this scenario ?

I am not making up this TNR stuff. I have been a volunteer with a variety of rescue groups for several years. TNR has evolved as the most effective approach to dealing with cat populations, particularly in urban settings. It cuts down on the nuisance complaints from neighbours (no more stinky tomcat spray, yowling, kittens), it curbs the population which will die out from attrition,which will no longer increase when all the cats are s/n, and it is more cost effective than sheltering, and more ethical, too. To work best it needs to work in conjunction with accessible free or very low cost spay/neutering programs for pets.

Why mention how the bodies are disposed of ? Many people just take their pet to a shelter without doing any research about the probable outcome. They allegedly loved their cat, but not enough to keep it for life (insert “reason” why they can’t keep the cat like a new baby or allergic roommate or new sofa). They want to believe that their shelter experience is guilt free, and that their cat will get adopted quickly. Even if it is geriatric. Even if it is a pee-er with health problems. Many dump their older pet when their new puppy or kitten, isn’t getting along with the older one. Like within 48 hours they make this decision and go to the local shelter with a pet that has loved them for 10 or more years. Most people who take their animal to a shelter do not understand that their former pet will literally end up as garbage - and that this is 100% their responsibility for this happening. Yes, there are some people who have very legitimate and heartbreaking reasons why they must surrender their pet to a shelter. Sadly, they are the minority. I wish that every person who surrenders an animal to a kill shelter for a trivial reason would be obligated to hold their animal as it is euthanized. The pile of bodies that get stacked up are a result of people’s decision to not consider the responsibilities to their pet as a commitment that should last for as long as that pet lives. I also wish that there were more options for people who are faced with surrendering a pet because of things like sudden poverty, or a life-threatening illness, or moving into a shelter for victims of domestic violence that does not allow pets.

I don’t care what happens to my body after I am dead either. But I do have feelings about the body of a loved one, and the way it should be handled, while I am alive.

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I always get a pain in my chest when I see cats that are obviously street cats like this one. My bleeding liberal heart starts worrying about where they sleep, if they eat, all the cars, etc. I’ve got two rescue cats right now. I struggle not to take them ALL home. I have this recurring fantasy where I magically come into a huge sum of money and get to buy the houses to the side and behind me, turning on entirely into a cat paradise of toys and shelves and pillows.

(Damn, I know I’m kind of on edge for personal reasons but the comments are crazy hostile lately. It’s demoralizing. Perhaps I need a break from the internet.)

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29

Goddamn catnip again.

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You make many good points about this situation which is obviously close to your heart.

But +1 dial it back a notch. Take a step back out of people’s faces, and we’ll be talking about the cats instead of your tone.

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You can’t save them all. No one can. But you can volunteer with a group that can help some. If your heart is too soft and you want to take them all home, then you can volunteer behind the scenes with the mundane tasks like answering email inquiries or cleaning carriers. Small things can really make a big difference sometimes. Jump in and volunteer.

p.s. Buy lottery tickets, too. You never know.

32

Having worked with several cat rescues over the years – from trapping to fostering to spay/neuter clinics to winter feeding stations – I thoroughly understand SatinSatan’s explication.

Having worked with several cat rescuers over the years – the preaching, the scolding, the guilt tripping – I thoroughly understand the call for SatinSatan to tone it down.

And there it is: the dichotomy of cat people. Can’t really live with 'em, but Bog help the kitties if we had to live without 'em. My first tagalong with a rescue was to an abandoned house that had just been razed; literally dropped into its basement. No one from the city or the demo contractor seemed to care that there were about 30 cats inside at the time. Enter the rescue folks. 15 cats were pulled alive from that wreckage before we were busted for trespassing. Getting them all fixed, and fixed up – infections, tooth troubles, broken bones – took around $2K cash and, for some cats, lottsa time – money and time that the rescuers (and their vets, and their volunteers) didn’t really have…but within weeks most all those cats were back in their old neighborhood, ready to resume their lives. For me it was a one-of-a-kind adventure. But rescuers do that kinda shit all the time, and it blows me away.

Yah – rescuers can be strident, abrasive, and general PITAs…but they get it done. You don’t have to listen to your neighborhood rescuer, but at least write her a check once in a while. And when you see a cat like the one pictured here – an obvious feral with no tipped ear – let a rescuer know. Better yet, volunteer to set a trap and watch it. It’s kinda fun, kinda thrilling, and you’ll gain insight into a truly alternate lifestyle.

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Nah… it’s just it makes the thread a pain to read for others. I’m having to scroll past you a ton now.

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Personally, I walk by. He’s been doing OK for years, and I don’t believe that any assistance I offer is realistically going to do a lot to solve fundamental problems of which he is only a symptom. I personally think it’s more ethical to direct my resources to other causes that I believe are more important. That’s a calculus I get to make, just as you get to make your decision that animal suffering is more important than other causes which you could be spending your time and money on instead of your TNR activities.

So I’m not saying that what you do is wrong or that you should have different priorities, but I don’t think your values give you the right to tell me or anyone else how we should act and what we should do, or say that our actions or inactions are invalid.

In theory, wouldn’t destroying all strays be more effective? The only way it would be less effective is if your TNR-treated cats are out-competing all the new strays that arrive on the scene, meaning that these new strays die instead of the established cats. This doesn’t seem terribly humane, either.

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s2redux, I am person who, by no fault of my own, became a “rescue” person. After multiple donations of cash and food to the shelter, catching ferals, some at my own peril, and then paying for trap, spay, return for the adult, I thought it a bit unnecessary to get the lecture and Spanish inquisition. That was my point. No need to beat down people who are doing the best that they can with limited resources. I already have animals who I pay for vet bills, food and general welfare. The point I made about the shelter saying it is “no kill”, but it actually was in certain circumstances, is that they are not always going to tell you that until your back is up against a wall. There are a few shelters here, outside of the one I went to, but none of them were willing and/or able to take anymore animals on. That’s an unfortunate reality, but it also isn’t the fault of people actually trying to do the “right” thing.

I, myself, have mixed feelings about the TNR, because if I had not opted for it with the mother cat, she would have been euthanized. BUT, now her survival depends on me. Depending on my economic circumstances and if I have to move, that will become a problem for her, if I can’t socialize to her to some degree and find a willing adopting home. So I made the very big decision of keeping her alive, but it is a conundrum, and what the other commenter said about questioning TNR had merit.

Is it worse that I made a decision for her to be released to my charge, when my own future here is not solid? It’s not a black white issue, there are gray nuances to most situations.

And the truth is that the problem does lie with people who don’t spay and neuter in the first place, because later it becomes a burden for others to deal with it. When someone attempts to help, you don’t chastise them by insinuating that they should have done more. That’s not a way to get people on your side. I was actually not trying to insult Satin, but that was the way it was taken.

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No stray cats in my neighbourhood at all. Even the house cats have to be extremely wily to survive. Lots of coyotes and the occasional cougar wandering through makes for a somewhat fraught environment for housepets in general.

That said, my cat is 15 years old and has managed to survive all of this, despite being an indoor-outdoor cat. My theory is that he is both wily and a bit insane, which keeps him alert and distant from other animals. All the friendly kitties tend to become coyote chow fairly quickly.

When we moved here and realized that there were so many wild predators around we briefly considered trying to keep him indoors, but it is impossible. He would be miserable, we have 5 doors and kids coming and going all the time, and when we do lock him in he tends to piss on the kids beds as a form of protest. So out he goes, and he always comes back.

We have just accepted that he will get eaten at some point. He is 15, already in overtime. He loves his life. I have been severely criticized for his freedom, as if keeping him indoors, obese and miserable would be better for him. I hope when I am old that I have freedom of mobility, freedom to be myself.

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don’t tell me what to do<-ad nauseum.

i do like this sentence:
“The pile of bodies that get stacked up are a result of people’s decision to not consider the responsibilities to their pet as a commitment that should last for as long as that pet lives.”

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Moderator note: Let’s stay on topic and play nice. If people can’t I’ll have to spay and neuter some comments.

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whomever this person is, i don’t know them.

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Want to help this cat ? Donate to an established rescue in Sarasota, Florida, where this cat is located:

http://www.gsalinc.org/tnr-program

http://www.catdepot.org

http://www.nateshonoranimalrescue.org

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43

If you feel you know so much about this topic, then I guess I will see you volunteering at the next feral and stray spay and neuter clinic which happens tomorrow, smartypants ?

What I do know about this topic (rather a lot, actually, as both a cat lover and a conservationist) is precisely why you’ll never find me cooperating in the re-abandonment of homeless cats. Seriously, what kind of “cat lover” betrays them by dumping them back on the streets?

It costs more to house and care for that cat in a shelter for the minimum three days, then euthanize and dispose of the body than it does to have that cat neutered, vaccinated and returned to its original location.

Only when you don’t take into account the value of resources donated to TNR groups by vets and volunteers or underwritten by donors. You’ve also conveniently left the cost of maintenance and monitoring out of the equation, so you really are advocating Trap, Neuter, Re-Abandon.

There would be no TNR if these groups had to foot the entire bill for every single feral cat to be:

  • trapped (traps cost ~$50 each, volunteer time is valued at ~$22/hr.)
  • transported to a veterinarian ($0.14/mile deduction for charitable purposes + time at ~$22/hr.)
  • spayed/neutered (one organization pays $50/male, $70/female)
  • vaccinated and wormed (street value ~$40)
  • treated for injuries and diseases (TNR organizations economize by euthanizing many sick/injured cats)
  • transported back to the trap site (time + mileage)
  • fed and monitored daily for the remaining weeks or months of its life (~$5/month/cat for cheap bulk food [not including losses to rodents, raccoons, skunks, etc.] + time + mileage)
  • and retrapped, revaccinated, rewormed, etc. annually (should it survive that long).

When you multiply those costs by the estimated 50 million stray and feral cats in the U.S., the magnitude of the problem becomes clear.

Then there’s the costs to families, communities, and countries of injuries to pets and people from territorial feral cats, treatment of (and loss of life to) the diseases and parasites they transmit, contamination of the environment by their wastes, and loss of biological diversity as they prey on, compete with, and transmit deadly diseases and parasites to wildlife.

Regardless of whether the resources are donated or not, TNR is less humane and less effective than trapping cats for adoption, life in an enclosed sanctuary, or, failing that, euthanasia. TNR cats still live short, miserable lives during which they inflict pointless suffering and death on millions of other creatures, and they themselves die horrible deaths. The average TNR “colony” can only decline in size if the combination of sterilization and adoption is intensive enough to offset reproduction and immigration, and many “colonies” grow even faster post-TNR as they become attractive dumping grounds for socialized but unwanted cats. (Meanwhile, the majority of the approximately 2.7 million adoptable animals euthanized at shelters every year are dogs. Do you support TNR for dogs? If not, why not?)

TNR groups that are responsible and ethical have colony caretakers that commit to feeding at specific locations, and care for the colony cats on a daily basis. These cats are eartipped to mark them as spayed/neutered. Some groups micro-chip as well, so if the cat is injured, deceased or mistakenly taken to a shelter it can be returned to its caregiver.

Caretaker burnout is a huge problem for TNR groups, and the cost of microchip implantation adds another $10 to $50 per cat to the cost of TNR. (Does it bother you at all that many if not most neighbors of TNR projects don’t want their yards, neighborhoods, parks, etc. overrun by unsocialized cats?)

Instead of promoting animal misery, won’t you please join me in supporting enclosed sanctuaries as the only humane, responsible alternative to euthanasia, along with stronger licensing, sterilization, and leash laws for cats to attack the overpopulation problem at its source?

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The other issue, that I’m concerned about, is that once these cats are trapped, they are smart, remember the circumstances surrounding the traps, and avoid them like the plague. So now I not only have to worry about the welfare of this outside cat, but also whether I will be able to get additional rabies shots in the future. That puts the health of my animals, myself and my neighbors at risk. It is also an expensive endeavor since I already care for my own animals. The vets may give shelters a break on costs, but they don’t for the average person.

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Excellent points. Organized TNR efforts have the same problem of trap-wariness limiting their ability to manage the health of the cats under their “care.”

Which brings up another issue of concern: whether undertaking TNR will subject the caretaker to legal liability for the continuing care of the cats and for any damage they cause.

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Many TNR groups, especially in their beginning stages, pay all of the costs from volunteers own pockets. Donations from the public are accountable after a group registers charitable group status. Some TNR groups excel at fundraising, and corporations like Petsmart have made grants available for TNR purposes. The group I belong to received this grant - which covered the cost of really basic things like posters about the program and medical supplies - but the venue was donated, all the spay/neuters were done by licensed veterinarians who donated their services, vet techs donated their time, and many other volunteers donated their time/skills in whatever capacity to make this program successful.

Arguing down to the mileage penny/hourly rate doesn’t make sense. A person who works in low-end retail and a CEO of a large company make wildly differing income - but if they both volunteer to do the same task, isn’t their contribution of time/effort equal ? If a group of volunteers are working together for a goal, isn’t the successful goal the point of the effort - not the individuals ?

You continue to use the word “abandon”. Where I live, to access TNR, you must register your colony, and take an educational workshop. I do not know of any ethical TNR person who traps, neuters and releases cats, who does not monitor the colony, and provide daily food and water and shelters as needed(and medical care). Most TNR volunteers also make great efforts to make the colony as unobtrusive as possible - meaning that they do not leave garbage behind, they take pains to clean up animal waste, and seek permission from property owners. TNR volunteers communicate with each other, and word soon gets out about an improperly managed colony or rogue volunteers. Properly managed colonies are better/safer for the cats, as well as the people who live/work near the colony. Vaccinations are currently 3 year vaccines - and some studies indicate that many cats tested for titers have lifelong immunity from a single vaccination.

I am not sure what cost this brings to a person/family who is uninvolved with feral cats. Attacks towards humans from feral cats are rare, neutered feral cats are less aggressive/territorial towards other cats and people. There are few diseases that can be transmitted from cats to humans, and no airborne diseases I am aware of. Parasite transmission usually requires fecal/oral transmission, but many forms of wildlife also transmit these same parasites.

Sanctuary situations require very intensive management and can quickly go from utopian to nightmares in a short period of time when they become overwhelmed or mismanaged:

Citations are needed for your allegation that more dogs are euthanized in shelters, as in my municipality these numbers are in stark contrast to each other, with many, many more cats euthanized. There are feral dog colonies happening in places like Detroit - where an estimated 50,000 mostly intact homeless dogs are on the loose :

http://cnn.com/2013/08/29/us/michigan-detroit-stray-dogs/

See Eldad Hagar’s many dog rescue videos on YouTube from the Los Angeles area, too.

Caregiver burnout/compassion fatigue is a casualty for many volunteers but also in careers like social work, paramedics, medicine. Does this mean that no one should volunteer or do these careers because they might get burnout ?

You are asking for support for enclosed sanctuaries, but you have not provided any names or links to these groups, or studies that support this as a humane, viable alternative. Feral cats form colonies on the basis of resources, like food/shelter, as well as social/familial connections. They will chase cats out of the colony who do not function well within this community. It is rare for a feral colony to have hundreds of cats in one location. There tend to be adjacent smaller colonies where some members/territories overlap. A sanctuary with not enough square footage will be less humane and more stressful for the cats.

Here are some case histories of sanctuaries gone cruelly bad:

http://www.voxfelina.com/2010/07/sanctuary-in-name-only/

I support spay/neuter initiatives for ALL pets. I support rescue groups who are ethical and humane, who only adopt out s/n animals. I support responsible pet owners, who chose rescue/shelter animals and do not buy from pet stores or breeders. I also support conservation, good science, and ethical/humane behaviour towards people. Plus, I recycle, use public transit, shop in my local community, support my local library and make stuff.