Acknowledging that race is still a factor in the applications process is basically acknowledging that the USA still has deep-seated racial bias against minorities. Did she really think there was no more racism in America, and that taking race into account was excluding her based on something arbitrary like blood-type or shoe size?
Maybe you noticed when you read the article the author said $150/hour.
2 Likes
Reading comprehension not my bag. Maybe I need a tutor.
3 Likes
Abigail Fisher, look on the bright side, now you can write a new admissions essay describing the hardship of arguing your case before the Supreme Court, losing the case in front of the whole nation, and how that has made you humble and contributed to your personal growth.
11 Likes
Ending inheritance would go a long way as would a national draft for military or public works.
2 Likes
âBut itâs not a joke, according to Jia Tolentino, who tutored Fisher in the art of gaming the system.â
I wouldnât support military service because that has some cultural problems of its own, but mandatory public service for everyone (including and especially the children of the wealthy) during or right out of high school would be great.
Iâve worked in positions where I hired and managed early college students and almost across the board, the higher class the studentâs upbringing, the less equipped they were to take their jobs seriously or understand whatâs involved in providing good customer service. There were a lot of poorer students who had worked summer jobs in high school who were much more mature than I was at their age and they tended to be nicer, more compassionate people too.
I wouldnât expect such a suggestion to get any traction though, especially since the wealthy are influential enough that even if it were mandated, their kids would just get summer jobs at daddyâs non-profit and wonât even have to show up for them.
4 Likes
Sadly, I need to call out this statement as well-intentioned but deeply ignorant. For the sake of your kids, please bear with me.
First, I want to appluad your viewpoint. I agree with you, as it fits my experience to aâTâ.
But now for the bad news. Itâs called âthe collapse of youth employmentâ
In our modern world, itâs almost impossible to execute on your plan. Those âshiity jobsâ arenât generally available to un-degreed youths with scant work experience. Automation has eliminated entry-level clerical work (typist, receptionists, check-out clerk). Whatâs left is reserved for employees who are likely to stick around long enough to justify the cost of training.
The âphysicalâ jobs, like yard work, out-of-sight restaurant work (eg dishwashing), roofing, etc, are now generally some familyâs livelihood. Why would the boss hire someone who will be gone in three months?
This is not theoretical for me. My daughters are 19 and 21. Both were very good students, and are enrolled in challenging programs at âName Brandâ universities. I am very proud of both of them â they are taking their educations seriously for the privilege it is.
But my daughters have never âworkedâ in the sense you meant . They very much had summer âwork experiencesâ that either traded on their upper-middle-class acculturation or relied directly on family contacts. Or both.
I am not proud of that, but thatâs reality we found ourselves in, so we did the best by our kids that we could.
As I am sure you will.
feel free to BB message me if you would like to talk more.
5 Likes
The other problem with âsummer jobs to teach rich kids empathy for the poorâ is this:
There is a huge difference between âshort term shitty job for pocket moneyâ and âpermanent shitty job for survivalâ.
9 Likes
I think thatâs @beschizza misreading the article.
Iâve re-read it â at no point does Ms. Tolentino state that she tutored Abigail Fisher, only that she wrote essays for Abigail Fishers.
2 Likes
The people I know who have gone furthest in life have had that exactly that set of advantages: a stable, economically worry free backstop to life with parents who gave them lots of great experiences, but who nevertheless loved their kids enough to make them take on some shitty ass jobs to appreciate what they have, to learn to respect those who have to work that hard just to make it in life, and understand that if they arenât careful, there is a deep, dark abyss eager to swallow them back up.
Those are the really, truly privileged. And I mean that in the best possible way.
3 Likes
Ignorant?
Huh.
Seasonal work is still a thing- right? Lifeguarding? Camp counselor? Town Recreation Departments? Pools? Golf course crews? Any number of other short-term summer work? Restaurant hosting?
These things still exist. And theyâre still, at least in my part of the world, theyâre still overwhelmingly staffed by high-school aged students.
Maybe I wasnât clear in my initial posting: Iâm not talking about their first post-college jobs. Iâm talking about short term summer work while theyâre still in grade school. Those jobs are still there, and theyâre available to 14-18 year old kids because theyâre deeply low paying and seasonal- up here, thatâs really only 8 weeks or so.
So, yes: itâs not shitty job for survival. And yes, Iâm sure these jobs arenât easy to get. But thatâs still my best wish for them- that they have the benefit of understanding first hand what hard work for little pay can be.
2 Likes
I had a friend who, because he was 18 the summer ahead of senior year, was able to get a job as a literal gravedigger in the central valley. Absolutely shitty, shitty work, but he was on some sort of apprentice union scale* and was making $18 or $20 an hour which, back then was damned good money. And it meant he bought himself a sweet-ass Camaro at the end of the summer. I never saw him all summer â woke up at 5, drove an hour an and half, dug in the ground in 105F temperatures and came home and went to sleep at 6 pm, and he was too sore on the weekends to so much as come to the door. His Mom was so happy with this I canât tell you.
- Just remembered it was a federal cemetery so while he wasnât union, he got prevailing wage.
6 Likes
Anyone in Austin TX ⌠they are in desperate need of lifeguards. $13.03/hr.
1 Like
Honestly, I believe that it starts with some serious due diligence early in life, on the part of the parents;
Not automatically just giving your kids whatever they want, making them earn their privileges, instilling a good work ethic by having them do chores, etc.
And thatâs just the basic foundation; personally, Iâve also had my kid volunteer with local charities, and community endeavors.
I see other folks in this thread are of the same mind; good for all of you.
3 Likes
Times are tough in the Tudor jobs market:
2 Likes
Yes, it is.
But those posts have gotten competitive. Letâs go through your list, because I know kids who have worked all of these jobs.
Lifeguard. Required an extensive training course, an âinternship,â â and finally a connection to get K and her brother the post. Did I mention that K was a state-level competitive swimmer?
Camp Counselor. Yes â both my daughters both did this. unpaid.
Town Recreation Dept. very competitive where I live. So competitive that our city now a runs program in which the kidâs âjobâ is funded directly by the parents. S1 did this. I am not making this up.
Golf Course Crew. If you mean landscaper, forget it about where I live. Thatâs a year-round job with long-term employees. Perhaps itâs different where it snows. If you mean caddy, then yes, but you are very much trading on your kidsâ upper middle class acculturation - they have to have spent enough time on golf courses to be a plausible caddy.
Restaurant Hosting. Bingo. this one still works. It still helps to be attractive (less so for waitstaff). Consistent with historical norms, more likely for young women than young men.
If your kid is an extrovert and the store manager senses that your kid might be one of the âpopularâ kids, sales staff at youth oriented retail like Forever 21 or Pacsun works well
Sporting Goods stores were also good source of youth retail jobs until recently, but this sector is getting crushed.
Grocery stores also like to hire kids who resemble their shoppers.
E got a plum job at Trader Joes. Did I mention she is tall, blonde, has a dynamite smile, and committed to working past the end of summer? Also, M got a union job at Gelsons! but M made clear that she would be there for several years, as she worked her way through Community College. B got job sacking groceries for the summer, but that was 15 years ago, his father helped, and I believe his job has since been eliminated.
Do consider, temp agencies. My daughterâs have gotten short-term gigs through this.
The biggest source I have seen for jobs like you describe are Amusements parks and âcountyâ fairs. But then, I live in California.
Itâs not impossible. But these jobs are much harder to secure than they were even 10 years ago. Please do read the link I provided.
S2, who has just finished his first year of computer engineering and has extensive work experience (including a supervisor at the local car dealership repair shop that adores him after an internship there during high school) went ZERO FOR NINETEEN trying to score a summer job.
S2 is literally out there begging for work. Anything. Handy man. yard work. cat sitting. shit shoveling. he doesnât care. he just wants to work. and he canât a find a job.
The world has changed. Many things are still possible, but for the sake of your kids, please study how the world has shifted since you had your experiences. I have seen so, so, so many parents take your stance, and even your exact arguments, and crush their children under unrealistic expectations.
7 Likes
I appreciate your concern for me crushing my kids with unrealistic expectations.
Thank you.
2 Likes
You can always tell when a Tudor has rewritten an admissions essay, because what high schooler writes like this?
To speke of peace certeynly as now hit ys no tyme, Albehit that I doo in my hart therfore ryght sore lament, but want of trowth ys so depely in the Frenche Nacion enrotid, and theire insaciable apetite to extent theire bondes and to accroche from other their Domynyons and possessions to the grete molestyng and trowbelyng of all the nacions abowte theym, ys so manyfest and notorys to all the world
12 Likes
