Oklahoma cops can use scanners to seize funds from prepaid debit cards without criminal charges

[Read the post]

1 Like

At this point, Iā€™m beginning to wonder what the difference, if any, is between cops and a ā€œFriendly Neighborhood Businessmen Group Fire Insuranceā€ racket.

25 Likes

But if the person has proof that it belongs to him for legitimate reasons, thereā€™s nothing going to happen. We wonā€™t seize it.

So much for the presumption of innocence. Whereā€™s your proof?

No person shallā€¦ be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

29 Likes

Civil forfeiture is crime perpetrated by the state.

Enough is enough.

No bucks for you, enforcersā€¦

:wink:

P.S. I suggest we eliminate forfeiture laws because they are unjust bureaucracies at best, criminal enterprises at worstā€¦

19 Likes

And I am lawā€¦

Make it so.

2 Likes

The Friendly Neighborhood Businessmen Group Fire insurance are less predatoryā€¦

11 Likes

You can trust the Businessmen not to shoot you outrightā€¦

17 Likes

And theyā€™ve been known to wh sack staff who get out of hand.

7 Likes

27 Likes

This is even more sickening than stop-light camera companies getting a cut of the fines collected. Itā€™s absolutely unconstitutional.

7 Likes

Presumably this ā€˜advanceā€™ is to deal with people who use prepaid cards as a less-visible way of transporting cash without getting a financial institution too deeply involved in the matter(obviously VISA and Amex are involved, since they are the payment processor; but thereā€™s way less scrutiny than a bank account-linked card).

That said, seizing money that is lodged with a financial institution is architecturally even easier: you just send them a request on the appropriate legal letterhead and they twiddle a few bits in the database.

It makes me wonder whether the scheme is prepaid-cards-only for the moment just because itā€™s easier to keep that off the record(unlike a bank, which isnā€™t going to stick its neck too far out for you; but probably does keep records); or whether itā€™s just good policy to confine the bulk of the ā€˜civil forfeitureā€™ to flavors of value transfer preferred by poor people nobody cares too much aboutā€¦

7 Likes

Logged into the thread to say the exact same thing.

What do you expect from a state that thinks ā€œOklahoma is OKā€ is a good tourist slogan?

Waitā€¦ now I understand; theyā€™re trying to make it to ā€œOKā€. Wishful thinking!

3 Likes

ā€œOklahoma is OKā€ because, as the joke told by a Texan went, ā€œOkies are too dumb to spell mediocre.ā€ Apparently, ā€œcontractā€ is out of reach as well.

11 Likes

Iā€™m wondering- Could you erase or corrupt the data on the strip with a strong magnet? Could you make a ā€œkiller cardā€ that would damage the deviceā€™s read head?

2 Likes

Maybe coat the stripe with whatever matchheads are made of.

ā€œYo Cletus, you try this, I canā€™t get it to read.ā€
ā€œCome on, you donā€™t know how to read a card? Just give it a good hard fast swipe.ā€

Let the card soak in water whenever you get where youā€™re going.

1 Like

Whose brilliant idea was this?

4 Likes

Wow. I canā€™t imagine that this could possibly disproportionately target any particular demographicā€¦ like say, the urban poor that canā€™t qualify for ā€œrealā€ credit cards, and who load their paycheck on a prepaid card for the exact same reasons you would if say you werenā€™t comfortable carrying large quantities of cash in certain parts of town.

23 Likes

Erasing or mangling mag-stripe cards isnā€™t too hard: ISO 7811 defines magnetic stripes with coercivities from 300(LoCo) to 4000(HiCo) Oersteds; with 2750 being another common value. The low coercivity ones are usually the cheap seats: printed paper bus passes or copier stored value cards with mag stripes, most credit cards are high coercivity; but modern rare earth magnets are pretty punchy; and a bulk tape eraser or other degaussing tool is really punchy.

The problem is that, if you destroy the stripe, the card will be similarly useless when you try to buy something with it. If you are lucky, the clerk will be willing to enter the embossed digits manually(though the cops can do the same thing); and vendors of prepaid payment cards tend not to be very helpful when youā€™ve given them money and now canā€™t get it back, so getting a replacement issued is unlikely.

As for destroying the reader, Iā€™m not sure: commercial-grade mag stripe readers are pretty durable mechanically, since they are expected to endure about ten zillion swipes from grimy cards held by hurried and incompetent users without throwing too many errors; but they do need to have relatively sensitive magnetic read heads; and exactly what overvoltage those read heads and the accompanying ADC circuitry can survive would depend on the manufacturer. I suspect that close contact with a proper degaussing wand would likely be warranty voiding; but Iā€™d be much less certain that you could get something into the size and shape of a payment card that would do the job.

4 Likes

Their maybe a bit of a deeper bit of information.

Iā€™ve had a credit card ā€˜skimmedā€™. The thing they do is buy prepaid debit cards before you can cancel: phone cards,gift cards and game cards. One of the charges was for a 200 dollar phone card and another PS game card.

From the looks at the haul in the pictureā€¦Iā€™m thinking itā€™s probably skimmers buying cards and not drug dealers exchanging gift cards.

4 Likes

Just another way to square the circle of people who want a tax-free police state: the vendor presumably offered them a slightly better price upfront, so the impact of these on the documented-and-discoverable budget is reduced; with the meat of the deal coming in as their cut of some years of murky and opaque seizures.

Evil; but not stupid-evil.

3 Likes