Same-sex civil unions supported by Pope Francis

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Bill Donahue - President (and perhaps sole member) of the Catholic League will call the Pope an anti-Catholic bigot and demand his excommunication.

The media will cover him extensively.


Further evidence we’re in a simulation? Things I had not expected to say before recent years: “Despite everything else that’s happening in politics, at least the Pope is a liberal.”


I think the only person with the authority to excommunicate the Pope is the Pope.

Bill Donahue is free to split away from the Catholic Church, but then he will be excommunicated.


From your lips to Frank’s ears!


Technically, in this moment we have two Popes, but I don’t think an excommunication will happen, because the two popes are in contact.
By the way is stating that isn’t a marriage, and for the catholic church sex is allowed only into marriage.


Pope Benedict retired, and what I am finding online says that a Pope Emeritus is subservient to the reigning Pope.

The only way Pope Francis is getting excommunicated is if Pope Francis says that Pope Francis is excommunicated. I think the implication is that if a Pope does something that would warrant excommunication then God will strike him dead on the spot, and as Pope Francis is still alive we can assume that God doesn’t disapprove of what he said.

But I am just an ex-Anglican atheist who is reading Roman Catholic canon law websites, so I could be wrong.


It’s a start. I wish he would say something similar relating to trans people. I can look to his statement and see how it applies there but the people who need to hear it most will ignore the broad application.


There is such a thing as automatic excommunication. It doesn’t have to be imposed by anybody: it just happens when you, for example, commit heresy.


My first thought was “Separate but equal”*, but this pope’s idea of civil unions isn’t anything close to equal. The church will never support adoption rights for anything but heterosexual marriages, and gay people will still be considered “disordered”.

*Not that separate is ever equal.


It’s going to make the conservative Catholics have conniptions, so I have to support it just for that.

As for the Pope, my position is “damning with faint praise”.


I 100% agree.

I do think (and I have to give credit to a CBC reporter for this insight) that the pope has considerably more clout in some South American and African countries than in North America or Europe. If you are living in a country where gay marriage is already legal this seems like an irrelevant person with no political power spouting off about a “progressive” agenda that is about 30 years out of date*. But if you are living in a country where being gay is still punishable by 10 years in prison - and that is justified by religious appeals - then this might be useful ammunition in your fight for change.

* I remember gay people arguing for civil unions before marriage was legal. And yeah, it was separate but equal. I think a lot of the activists thought of it as a foot in the door.


Completely meaningless, and we’re already seeing bishops lining up to contradict their pope, demanding “clarification” (meaning they want him to say that the gays are all sick pervert deviants, but God loves them!), etc. What Pope Frank could do, if he so chose, is issue a papal bull, which is an official statement of policy with full papal authority behind it. He’s already issued one (basically a happy feel-good declaration sort of thing back in 2015), but he could easily set Church doctrine right this minute if he wanted to, and he’s officially infallible so Bill Donahue and other reactionary homophobes will have to accept it (or splinter into breakaway sects).


My limited understanding is that, should Benedict object to Francis’ comments, we enter into a three round Pope-off to determine whose ruling takes precedence. The talent portion of the competition promises to be amusing. Benedict’s juggling is on point, but Francis’ close-up magic is a real sight to behold. The speeches could be interesting, but are typically just a rehash of popular talking points. The traditional reliance on a swimsuit competition as the tie-breaker has been sufficient deterrent to prevent the conflicts from escalating to this point throughout much of history.


Having a Jesuit Pope was always going to be interesting…

I must have a chat with my local priests about this one, they live two doors down.

Poor guys, they came here from India a few years ago to here in :canada: to replace the disgraced predecessor (“usual” reasons, per neighbourhood gossip) and have had a tough go of it.


Papal infallibility is a rarely used weapon: it’s not been deployed since 1950, when the Assumption of Mary was declared an article of faith, and had only been used once before that, in 1854, for a similar declaration re the Immaculate Conception. In both cases the Pope checked beforehand that the bishops would back him.

I wouldn’t hold your breath that Frank is about to declare ex cathedra the validity of gay marriage, or even of gay civil unions.


To be fair, they could change in the future. To do that, both the people working in the institutions (priests, monks, nuns, bishops, etc) and the members of the laity have to demand that change. Despite the top-down nature of the church, it’s not and never has been a static institution. Since Vatican II, there have been major changes to the organization that I think many would never had imagined could have happened, but now have, like having services in vernacular instead in Latin, having the priest face the congregation during Mass, etc.

But as it stands right now, this is absolutely the case.



While they are super slow to reflect social change, I feel like Catholics at least have rational thought behind their position. In this case they realize that marriage isn’t only a religious act, and there are a ton of legal things it effects in the secular world. They shouldn’t be denied those things.


One local Trumper I know has told me at length about what a great Catholic he is, but I’ve also heard him call the Pope “a communist.”

This documentary might be the line drawn in the sand for many Catholics, which is ironic for anyone who stayed faithful during decades of church sex abuse scandals.


Just wait until he finds out about Jesus.