Not sure what that has to do with coherent plots.
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Absolutely nothing. As @robertmckenna noted above, for plays and movies and TV shows where the showrunners are diligent there’s a long-established refinement process involving writers, directors, actors, continuity people, show “bibles”, etc.
Star Trek has accepted and produced spec scripts from fans and paid tribute to certain super-fans (the “Geordi La Forge” character was named after one). Preview performances/screenings are also a tried-and-tested way of getting audience feedback. But asking fans to vet scripts and give notes as a standard practise would be disastrous.
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You’re right of course. Lots of films do the workshopping process which is key to most theatre. And yeah, telly with a trusted cast too I’ve heard of TV doing it.
I was surprised by how little rehearsal time many movies have. Willing to throw money at doing it as takes though. Doesn’t make sense to me.
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I’m just going to leave this here (starting at the beginning, which is page 22)…
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It’s clear you didn’t even finish the first season because if you actually did you would find that
- The first season wasn’t entirely about the war. More than a third of the season was spent in the mirror universe trying to get back.
- You clearly missed the point of the overall story about how federation ideals and optimism can survive a costly war.
- The war ended at the end of s1 and a big exciting reveal occured kicking off the story into a new direction for s2.
Lets not also forget that most Trek series have uneven first seasons. Outside of maybe a handful of episodes I recommend everyone ignore S1 of TNG.
This is the gatekeeping I am referring to. Trek is MANY things. It is not just this simple formula that TOS put out. Lower Decks showed us (the animated show, not the TNG episode) that the Second Contact team is as important to Starfleet and the Federation as exploration and first contact.
So was DS9 also not “real trek”? How about all of s3 of Enterprise? Claiming Star Trek devolved into pessimism and action shows you kinda haven’t ever been paying attention to what Trek involves.
But honestly, if you aren’t going to actually watch the show I refer back to my original point. Why do you think you feel qualified to complain about the quality of the show without even experiencing it? S1 of DSC may have not been your ball of wax but to throw the whole show under the bus with such arrogance is mindboggling to me as a fan of the equality and ideals Star Trek portrays.
You will find no love for those films from me. But that more has to do with my distaste of JJ as a director. But what you won’t find me doing is finding the weakest of excuses on a related article to bash how terrible the films are.
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Even when Trek does war, it still ends up being Trek.
In both shows the wars were ended ultimately by saving their antagonists.
DS9 ends with Odo saving his people, the aggressors in the Dominion War.
S3 of Enterprise, the ship and humanity were saved by friends they made and gaining trust of their enemies.
Now if you want to pillory DSC for stuff you have things like:
- The awful redesign of the Klingons. Makeup so uncomfortable looking that actors can’t even effectively speak under it
- That the entire universe seems to literally revolve around Michael Burnham
- That Tilly deserves at least a provisional promotion to Lt Jg after 2 seasons of wild stuff way beyond her academy field training requirements
- That neither Michael nor Georgiou have come clean with Saru about how they ate his species.
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- That is subjective. I actually enjoyed the new design. The season 2 slight changes made it a bit better. But then, this is also par for the course for klingons and alien make up. Trek often finds a way to tweak it out along the way (look at Worf S1-2 and then S3, or completely changing the way Trill look between TNG and DS9)
- Hardly. It only appears that way because this is the first trek show that is not designed to be an ensemble (or a duo/trio as TOS was) DSC is at its core Micheal 's story. Not anyone elses.
- Tilly is amazing. She deserves her recent promotion (altho last I checked she is still an ensign isn’t she?) and is a logical choice given the circumstances. Also, look to Hornblower. Rodenberry did and was inspired much by older Horatio in Kirk and Pike. Tilly is much more younger Horatio to me.
- Would you want to be the one to tell Saru that happened? I can see Georgiou doing it out of spite, but I would think Micheal wouldn’t want to have to confront that. But Saru also understands, in the Mirror, everyone had to do things they never would just to survive.
As did DSC. Their solution was, shall we say, unique? Ended it with no further bloodshed and directed the klingon empire into the state of cold war we encounter 10 years later in TOS.
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As for #4 I see Michael eventually feeling guilty but admitting Kelpian was delicious. I see Georgiou telling Saru she has dibs on his ganglion if he dies.
Saru: Commander Burnham, why do you begin to salivate every time I enter the bridge?
He doesn’t have those anymore. I wanted to see a deleted scene right after they fell off with Philipa in the hall outside saying “you gonna keep those Micheal? I will take them to the trash for you”
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They are not allowed. When Geek and Sundry aired Shield of Tomorrow (a Star Trek RPG series) it seemed way to obvious to include Will Wheaton, so they had to clarify that he (and other actors who worked on the tv show) are forbidden to portray characters in the franchise “outside”.
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I did finish the first season.
I didn’t say it was entirely about war, I said it was more pessimistic and war and action focused.
I did see that season 2 looked to be going in a different direction, but due to my disappointment, I just haven’t watched it yet. I do think I have season 2 on file, IIRC. Maybe I will be pleasantly surprised when I get around to it.
I am not here to say what is and is not real Trek. Certainly war and action are components of the series. DS9 dealt with the war aspect well. TNG had the battles with the Borg. But if you don’t see a tonal shift in Trek that continued into Discovery, and to a degree the reboot movies - then I don’t know what to tell you. IMO The Orville is the spiritual successor.
I even said to my friends, as Sci-Fi action, Discovery was pretty good, but there were still things that bugged me about the story that knocked me out of the suspension of belief.
I am qualified to complain about the parts I have seen because I have a keyboard and internet connection. Though I don’t think my criticism was especially harsh or different than other critical receptions.
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The Orville is a cheap remake of TNG with dick and fart jokes. If you feel that is a spiritual successor to Trek then clearly we are going to always disagree.
And again, on a post praising the cast members playing DnD why do you feel that is appropriate? I just don’t understand why nerds like yourself go out of your way to bash the show.
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I’ve developed a new rule of thumb when it comes to Trek series; the more “proper” Star Trek fans complain about it, the more likely that I’ll enjoy it.
Although given how much they complain about every single new show (I’m just old enough to remember the vitriolic reaction to TNG. And to DS9. And Voyager, and…), I guess it’s not perfectly reliable.
Anyway, for non treikkies, if you enjoy scifi shows with spaceships, Disco is pretty good.
Also this series they have a cat, making it at least 10% better. That’s just science that is.
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“That cat has its own gravitation field”
-Ensign Tilly
“Oh and I wasn’t kidding about Porthos. Tellarites consider canines a delicacy. I would keep him away from the conference”
-Ensign Sato
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I think you will find that she is a queen thank you very much.
Well that is definitely the elevator pitch, and it certainly would have been the overused opening line in many a review in 2017. (Not that Discovery didn’t attempt some gross out humor and dropped an F-bomb to attempt to be funny.) Past the pilot episode, while humor is still part of show, the dick jokes were less prevalent. The characters were all flawed to a degree (more human, I suppose), with interpersonal drama played out between them. It still is a solid sci-fi show that, IMO, pays homage to TOS and TNG. Like both of those shows (and classic sci fi) they addressed controversial contemporary topics, but in unfamiliar settings and scenarios. Like the idea of gender identity and sexual assignment through the lens of an alien species who are supposedly all born male. One of the ship’s officers has a female baby hatch with his partner. One wants to subject the baby to the required gender reassignment surgery, and the other one does not.
But OK, even if one doesn’t like the jokes, characters, or story lines, one has to admit the tone and overall plot lines line up way more closely with TOS and TNG.
Just from a visual perspective, here is the Orville bridge.
Here is the Discovery bridge:
Compare to TOS and TNG
It reminds me of the DC movies who think darker and edgier = more serious and grown up.
Again, Discovery isn’t responsible for this direction, it has slowly slide that way for awhile. The TNG movies I think show this slide as well. I feel like the producers think the audience is too dumb to sit still with out some violence and action and perpetual conflect. (Maybe that is partly true 
)
But I say that just to support my point that Orville is a more spiritual successor. I still would like to see a more optimistic tone in Trek overall, but could enjoy something like Discovery if I liked the episodes more. It was rather meh for me. If you loved season 1, more power to you.
My comment was about how movies and shows in general would benefit from running stories through an RPG to see if it makes sense. This wasn’t necessarily aimed at Discovery, thought it could benefit from better writing. It was reaffirming what a good thing actors RPGing is, and how it could be used to craft better media.
If you find that “bashing”, your threshold for criticism must be very low. Since then I did elaborate on issues I have with Discovery, but that again is rather tame criticism, not “bashing”. If you are !100% happy with it, then I encourage you continue your CBS All Access pass and continue to enjoy it.
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Um, is there some reason why people are writing Orwell when they mean Orville? Or am I failing a perception roll again?
Oh, and I am grumpy that they are playing D&D instead of the superior GURPS.
Well, not really.
I just like plugging GURPS.
Fnord.
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See: Kim, Harry, Ensign.
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Because im an idiot and didn’t even bother to correct it?
/s
Alternatively: I was so blinded by anger against trek gatekeeping I missed the fact 44 didn’t even name the show properly.
Second alternative: The Orwell is the name of the ship in the Orville Mirror Universe.
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An Orwellian take on The Orville!
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