Oh, I wouldn’t go THAT far.
I mean, I’m one of those who agrees that maybe ‘raid’ wasn’t the best choice of words, it’s just not significant in comparison to the fact that our federal government is using legal shenanigans to avoid accountability.
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I think the inability to recognise a whole website that contains nothing but op ed is borderline delusional.
robulus: Please report to reception to collect your internets.
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Hey, hey, man… This is a thread about the word “raid”. Take your article subject pedantry elsewhere, buddy.
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@Gendun You can always join the third category of people who make comments about how you have to tow the party line. That seems to be an increasingly popular club.
Whose line is it anyway?
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I call BS. A blog is merely a website with entries ordered by date. Blogs range from trivial personal journals to world class investigative journalism. Merely noting that BoingBoing is in blog format is not a valid excuse for it to misrepresent facts - especially given that BoingBoing frequently engages in media criticism over such things as bad or sloppy journalism. It can’t have it both ways.
I think Cory can be cut some slack on this one because, for once, the inaccurate wording he used comes from the source material rather than Cory’s fast and loose hyperbole. However, the ACLU was being equivocal. A raid implies, at the very least, an involuntary seizure by force - swat tactics optional. In this case, it hasn’t been established that the state was not complicit in the transfer of the documents. The ACLU may have meant “raid” in a metaphorical sense, as in “raided” from the public.
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Weeell, since we’re being pedants in this thread, I believe the expression you are looking for is “toe the line”, as in keeping the terminal segments of your lower extremities on a thin, continuous, real or imagined mark, possibly used to identify a border or a boundary.
Though I do commend you for the umlaut on über.
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[quote=“Skeptic, post:45, topic:33551”]
I call BS. A blog is merely a website with entries ordered by date. Blogs range from trivial personal journals to world class investigative journalism.
[/quote]Point taken. Lets just agree Boing Boing doesn’t represent itself as a news service. I completely disagree that if they criticise sloppy journalism they then have an obligation to adhere to high journalistic standards, that would mean music critics had to release awesome albums as well. I call BS on that.
Great. We’re agreed then.
A blog can be, but is usually not, journalism. Name derives from web log so it’s more akin to a diary - personal opinions and ideas, organised by date.
Also, you’re right about the chronology thing, but there are structural differences between what one would consider a website and a blog. Is a blog a website? Technically yes, but the biggest difference between what most people consider a website and what they consider to be a blog is structure (not to mention blogs require php). A blog is made of posts that are entirely independent of the theme and pushed from a database, whereas a typical website just has some folders with a heap of html files and doesn’t require a database of any sort.
So, U.S. Marshals, which are the enforcement arm of the Federal Courts and a part of the Justice Department, confiscated records which the ACLU had legally requested from the Sarasota Police Department, which had agreed to make the documents available, and in fact had made an appointment with the ACLU to view said documents.
Further, Florida law requires the Sarasota Police Department to hold onto the records for at least 30 days once it had received the ACLU’s request, EVEN IF THERE IS A LEGAL DISPUTE over them, which would have given the ACLU a chance to argue its case in court to obtain the records.
Words, they fail me.
I’m putting the Justice Department on Double-Secret Probation.
Now back to the semantic distraction already in progress…
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I mean, we could all choose to get sucked into a pedantic debate over which verb best suits… if you’re that easily distracted.
We could also choose to remain focused on the US Marshalls seizing (to prevent the release of, under applicable legal statute and in accordance with precedence) state law enforcement records and stop to think on that a second.
They must really have something to hide.
It’s also HARDLY the outrage of the day. You could make your point much more effectively with a private letter. Stop changing the subject.
Now that your opinion of cory isn’t the subject, what do you think of the ACTUAL STORY
You’re capable of getting past a headline, RIGHT? Not trollin’, RIGHT?
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He’s not objecting to Cory so much as the language Cory has chosen to use. [quote=“AcerPlatanoides, post:50, topic:33551”]
We could also choose to remain focused on the US Marshalls seizing (to prevent the release of, under applicable legal statute and in accordance with precedence) state law enforcement records and stop to think on that a second.
[/quote]Is there precedence for the release of these types of files (and if there is, isn’t the request somewhat duplicative)? Presumably the US Marshalls have a duty to protect state secrets as well.
I disagree. BB authors have chosen to identify themselves as journalists in their bios, they have argued that bloggers deserve the same legal protections as journalists (which they actually already have), engaged in vigorous media criticism including criticizing a factually accurate, humorous tweet, and have lately taken to identifying themselves in the third person in the lead-in to their feature pieces (e.g., “As Cory Doctorow discovered, the reality is a little more complicated…”), while also linking to their journalism in the blog section. At the very least there’s co-mingling of journalism and non-journalism here, with wildly inconsistent standards that they would find objectionable in other media outlets.
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Strawman, robulus. It doesn’t mean music critics have to produce professional music, but it does mean that if they do, their music can and should be held to the same standard the critic holds other musicians to. For the critic not to do so, to hold themselves to a lesser standard, is called hypocrisy.
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That was a pretty short hunt.
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when they go back to wearing non warzone gear to pick up some boxes, people will stop calling it a raid
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How secret? Secret enough to have been secret the whole time? Or secret only after some arbitrary point in time? Why would a judge order the relase of Super Double Secret Records?
So, presumably the police can file for an injunction.
But in reality they just do what they want, get their way, make shit up after the fact, and due process is for us losers. We also get to endure their apologists. Yay.
I have no idea what your point is, or what you’re possibly contending here.[quote=“AcerPlatanoides, post:56, topic:33551”]
Why would a judge order the relase of Super Double Secret Records?
[/quote]
No judge ordered the release of any records to the ACLU in this incident. If you read the linked articles you would find that the state police were responding to a FOIA-style records request, and that there was no court order or failure of due process.
The police were prepared to release the information; it’s the US Marshals who prevented this from happening. The ACLU can file for an injunction… and guess what? They have.
Says the devout BoingBoing apologist.
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Holy crap!
Are people still arguing over the proper use of ‘Raid’ rather than being properly horrified by what our government is actually DOING?
When this thread started I didn’t have the right swear words for this, and now some of you want me to invent even more new ones?
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Pretty obvious. The documents weren’t a federal secret. They’d been in the storage of an ordinary local police department - not in a secure facility for classified information. That is, until it became clear that the public would get to see them. Then suddenly, and arbitrarily they became federal secret documents, based on a likely post hoc deputizeation of the PD by Federal Marshalls.
It is actually possible to do both. They aren’t mutually exclusive.
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