This is what I like to think of as the driver’s folly - “Everyone else is a bad driver. I’m great”. Yes, it’s possible that your statement is true, but it’s far more likely, especially given the low-speed incidents being discussed in this topic, that there are lots of these sorts of incidents happening all the time that no one talks about because they’re not traditional “accidents”.
That 1% of accidents in the study covers all the dumbasses who don’t take riding seriously, after all. The same thing holds true for all drivers. It’s the whole reason graduated licensing - the idea that people need to age and take driving more seriously - is becoming more prevalent. But IMHO the reality is - until you actually find yourself in a difficult situation, “taking it seriously” is really just a mental exercise. Once you’ve been in peril, your outlook tends to change significantly.
My bike drops were: Pulling up to a fuel pump, put foot down, slipped on gas/oil on ground, slowly tilted bike, picked it up with friends laughing. And…waiting to enter traffic from driveway, in first gear and idling, clutch hand slightly slipped, gear engaged - bike “jumped” but didn’t go anywhere, engine stalled, bike slowly fell to the side.
I put 86,000+ miles on that bike before I sold it.
I ended up riding alone due to friends’ poor riding skills/not-giving-a-damn. Friends who split lanes at 85mph in heavy traffic…for kicks, friends who check their phones for messages while riding through intersections at high speeds, friends who consider a long ride being 20 miles between the local bars…where they get drunk and ride home, friends who won’t ride more than 400 miles a year…to keep resale-value on their “investment”, etc.
I found groups that don’t cater to any “style” of bike or riding to be the best to ride with. No drama, no hassles, family-friendly, no affiliation to biker gangs, etc. Fun for the weekends but most were based 50 miles away.
Actually not, completely average in every way, (great for buying clothes straight off the rack!)
But I have had a few custom seats because I loved the bike but it was just too high.
I have noticed that as I’ve gotten older heavier bikes are more comfortable, and I thought I was just getting stronger, (woot!), then a bike mechanic set me straight, said they’re intentionally designed with much lower center of gravity now. Thank god for ABS!
230kg, 780mm seat height (506lb, 31 inch), wide engine with all the mass right at the top.
Super-heavy clutch and a jerky powerband, too. Absolute bastard to ride; it overheated so much that you’d disappear in a bus-sized cloud of steam every time you rode through a puddle.
I’ve dropped dirt bikes onto dirt countless times. If you don’t, you aren’t dirt biking.
The first one I ever rode, a then brand new XT500, I dropped right before I ever rode it. I was a child.
All that doesn’t count.
When a R90 drops, it rests on only the wheels and one valve cover. If it hits the road hard, while riding, the end of your handle grip and possibly an exhaust make ground contact also. The damage will be minimal.
To the bike.
I’ve tried that on Hana highway (which consists entirely of turns). Loose gravel on a freshly topped stretch of road made my front wheel slip.
Other than that I’ve never dropped a motorcycle on a public street or had accidents.
My favorite mode of transportation, here and now, is this.
I crash hard and often, off road and in traffic. I’ve been very lucky.
It’s just so much fun, and too soon I will be too old to handle this type of fun.
Heh I’ve only dropped a bike once. Brand new Triumph Daytona (sigh - no longer manufactured), different seat height to its predecessor, kicked it with my heel as I dismounted and went into an inexorable slow decline.
As I cursed, I liked to think my new puppy was just over-excited and tired after leaving the litter.
When I took the MSF class in the mid-200s (because my license had expired because I had been living in China; I’d already been riding since about ‘82), I was told that a broken ankle is the most common injury. And that those came from dropping your bike while moving it around the yard/garage, or from putting your foot on a slick patch when you stopped at an intersection. I never followed up on it.
But I’ve laid a bike over three times in my life. Once when I had just started riding and was hooning around a parking lot like a dumbass (inexperience), and twice when had been riding for 20+ years and was moving my bike across wet grass in my back yard.
Anyway, I was thinking that maybe the stats for low speed incidents are from failed efforts at “power walking” or slippery pavement or whatnot.
Edit: Adding some stuff after scrolling up a bit: I’m 6’ and only ride small-displacement road bikes–my “biggest” bike was a 500–so I’ve never had a problem straddling a bike or picking it up. I am also and have always been extremely paranoid about safety on my bike. And also lucky.
Its a complete wonder that there arent more motorcycle (including large scooters up to 450cc) accidents here in Tokyo especially considering that lane splitting is now legal.
I learned to ride a motorcycle from an old biker when I was in college. The advice he gave me is “everyone will drop their bike at some point, if your motorcycle is too heavy for you to lift back up, its the wrong bike for you”. He also was very clear about being able to put both feet flat when stopped.
I havent owned a motorcycle since back then. I now ride a Honda Gyro Up
(not actually my bike but same configuration)
49cc two stroke engine, three wheels with a cargo bed in the rear. The baskets are options.
When I got my first bike, a guy with more experience said I should hold on to my feeling of fear about traffic and speed. He said it’s when riders lose that fear and become overconfident and fearless that they crash.
I’m not sure if he was right. Nevertheless, in the 30 years since that discussion, I have always tried to check myself when I start to feel comfortable in traffic or going fast. Sometimes I picture what could happen if a car in front of me swerved or braked. I try to get back some of that beginner fear.
This is what I like to think of as the driver’s folly - “Everyone else is a bad driver. I’m great”. Yes, it’s possible that your statement is true, , but it’s far more likely, especially given the low-speed incidents being discussed in this topic, that there are lots of these sorts of incidents happening all the time that no one talks about because they’re not traditional “accidents”.[/quote]
My statement is not opinion. It’s the result of the study we are discussing. The study itself shows exactly what I said: half of drivers hand no accidents at all during the study. No “low-speed incidents.” Nothing. Despite driving an average of 10,000 miles during the study. The other half of drivers had all of the incidents including a large number of “low-speed incidents.”
If you think the study is bogus that’s fine. But don’t claim it’s just a matter of opinion. It’s like people saying climate change or evolution are just somebody’s opinion. No. Like the results of this study showing half of drivers have no incidents, those are scientific conclusions based on evidence. If you’ve got other evidence, bring it on. But please don’t just reject science as “opinion”
Yeah, I had that same thought. I had more than my share of drops in my early 20s when I was partying a lot. Luckily never hurt anybody but myself. One time coming home from a concert, stopped at a light and forgot to put my feet down and just toppled over. Another time I left the wheel lock on. I wanted to impress a girl who was getting on the back of the bike so I revved it up and popped the clutch. The wheel was locked to the right so the bike just spun out. Luckily she jumped off before the bike spun in a circle and dropped. She was not super impressed. (Nevertheless, we are about to celebrate 24 years of marriage, so she must not have thought I was that big of a loser.)
Now it’s been over a decade since my last drop.
I didn’t get that impression from the comments at all, but instead took them to mean that extrapolating that data outward suggests that 50% of drivers dump their bikes and as much as 1% are poorly trained (or careless) in handling of their vehicles, both of which represent a significant quantity of people.
I don’t know about that but couple of paragliding fatalities of acquaintances of mine were result of “experieced” people taking risks no novice would be comfortable with.
