And habilitating adult men (not rehabilitating- they weren’t there in the first place) isn’t what’s needed as much as raising healthy boys.
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True enough, but i would posit that failure is due to lots of supportive Bro culture dudes telling them that women are subhuman. If we (men) make that attitude unacceptable in male spaces, it will wither on the vine.
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I know. But the reality is that this is a problem for us but is a problem that only men can actually solve.
You’re assuming this his online communities are the only ones that he’s a part of.
No, but clearly, you still believe it’s on women. I’m sick of cleaning up mens messes. It only gets us killed. The reality is that men are not proactive often enough at helping men in their own social circles to check their own shit. That would help tremendously. The Solution can’t be we let women suffer until they convince men to treat them as equals, because that’s not going to change much. Don’t you think that we’ve been trying to convince men of that since the beginning of civilziation? How many more centuries do we have to keep saying the same shit before men wake up?
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No I fucking don’t goddammit! I have stated over and over again that men will be responsible. But also, I’ve stated that at some point he will have to interact with women if he is to learn how to interact with women. Is that wrong? Will he learn to interact with women without actually doing it? That was the point of my first reply, and it’s the only point I wanted to make.
This is incredibly unproductive. Just forget that I ever said anything.
Where I think we’re “talking past each other” as you said, is that YOU seem to be arguing that men like this NEED to interact with women in order to change their minds. I’m arguing that there are plenty of men who regularly interact with women who believe in all these same things, despite that. The problem, the core of the problem, is men’s spaces and men’s interaction with each other. That is how the problem is going to get solved. This one particular guy “not interacting with women except his mom” doesn’t change the fact that even if he was interacting with women every day, that he embraces an ideology that seeks to violently put women in their place, which is but a more extreme version of the mainstream patriarchal views of women.
This is on men to change, because this crowd does not respect women at all. It’s up to men who DO to do the work of deprogramming their friends who buy into this shit. Women can’t do it, because these men START from the assumption that women are useless except for sex, child-bearing, and housework.
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First line:
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Yep…
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It would’ve been pretty interesting if, when the guy asked how much “height” had to do with “finding a mate” (which, c’mon, this is the first time he’s talked to a woman in years and these are the things he wants to ask about? So fucking shallow) if she’d asked him how much “weight” or “breast size” had to do with him selecting or lusting after a potential mate.
Instead she was completely lovely and kind.
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Maybe he should get a job. Half his coworkers will be women.
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Yeah, that might help, too.
I was very surprised there’s an acronym for not being employed or in school or training. These guys…
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I also wonder if he actually does interact with women, but he does not consider them women for some reason. Like, why doesn’t his mother count as a woman? That shows his attitude towards women is seated in the idea that women are there to care for men in different ways - some, like his mom, is to take care of him and clean up after him, and some are there for his sexual gratification. He’s clearly in a echochamber that reinforces that, but he probably already believed that stuff, and they just reinforced it.
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NEET is a Japanese thing tied in with Hikikomori.
But it’s spilled over as a useful term.
NEETs aren’t always shut ins but can be. Hikikomori are shut ins and often NEET.
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Started as a UK sociology/bureaucracy term. Moved onto other countries, including Japan. But anime is probably where most people know it from.
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That makes way more sense given the spelling.
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Are you suggesting that women are forcing him to stay inside, away from other human beings, and only interact via keyboard?
If the guy took a walk around the block every day, and maybe even picked up some groceries, he’d already be in a better head space.
No one owes him a lunch date.
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Ah, fuck, that last sentence.
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The song he was so desperate to play her?
“Baby it’s Cold Outside”
I’m sure we’ll be rehashing that old argument (seems to come up every year here) now that the winter holiday season is upon us.
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Ugh, after the Beatty story above the song that’s stuck in my mind is “We Have No Secrets” by Carly Simon. Based on the lyrics, I’m really hoping that one wasn’t about him, too! 
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