I am unfamiliar with THAT other allegations are
“How long has it been since you beat your wife” - see what I’m gettin at?
I saw it as this - he was f***ed up because he was in the closet. So he came out in an effort to get unf***ed up. I don’t think it was a distraction. It seemed more like a way to deal with one of the causes of his behavior.
Also, he’s not saying “I’m sorry you feel that way,” he’s saying “I’m sorry I made you feel that way,” which is a subtle, but significant difference.
One of the things we discussed in the coming out group I used to attend was the phenomenon of “coming out at the same emotional age you went in”. The closet - in addition to adding heaps of shame and self-hatred to the mix - arrests the progress of your sexual maturity at about the age you realize you had to hide who you were. This in no way excuses his behavior, but it does help explain it. Believe me, a closeted 20-something (or 30-something or whatever) getting drunk and behaving like a horny adolescent is something a lot of us have seen before. It is terrible that it was inflicted on a 14 year old.
5 Likes
Check your imagination against reality. re: minors - Sexual touching illegal. Touching in general, quite questionable.
Speech? Free.
1 Like
I’m not in the habit of googling everyone I ever heard of to see if there’s any dirt on them out there that doesn’t get mentioned in the popular press. Should I take up the habit? Sounds time-consuming.
It’s not a double standard at all (which phrase is more usually used in reference to morals), just an observation that if it doesn’t get mentioned at large then by definition it isn’t “well known”.
1 Like
its a world of difference, really. A whole human world.
not approving, but you’re correct about that.
2 Likes
I guess it depends on how you define “making a pass”. Based on Rapp’s description below, if any adult did that to another adult, it would constitute sexual harassment. Now, consider that this happened between a grown man and an eighth-grade boy.
“Spacey befriended Rapp while they both performed on Broadway shows, invited Rapp over to his apartment for a party, and, at the end of the night, picked Rapp up, placed him on his bed, and climbed on top of him, making a sexual advance.”
9 Likes
Again…your implication above (which comes across as rather condescending towards me) is that because you had not seen anything of substance on your chosen news outlets, then it precludes it is not well known and that I must be viewing something hidden/whisper based.
As I stated…it was a quick google search to dig up just a few hits of previous articles written about Spacey’s proclivities. I feel once more we have a distinct disagreement on what constitutes time consuming…for me it was a matter of 30-45 seconds and a couple of click-throughs.
I will now bow out of any additional conversation on this topic with you based on your replies to me and others in this thread. Enjoy your day.
1 Like
no, you asked me to NOT do that. make up your damn mind. What are you arguing?
You argued that “if any adult did that to another adult, it would constitute sexual harassment.”
And I am saying quite possibly, but is that the sort of thing you want the police involved in if it stops? If NO is taken as an answer, where is the crime, the immoral ACT. Yeah, it’s not okay if he did that. Sounds like he was fucked up at 26. I;m sure at 26 you were a saint, though I’d surely not assume you were inappropriate with a 14 year olds - which hasn’t been denied mind you.
But folks here are making assumptions that this is just the first sign of a lifetime of awfulness from the guy and maybe, maybe just maybe he learned his lesson without committing a crime? MOST PEOPLE DO.
So, lets not play semantic games, okay? Your one upsmanship isn’t serving the victim. Your semantics here objectify Rapp nearly as bad as Spacey did.
He isn’t for YOU to make assumptions about any more than he is for SPACEY to do so. You’re using him for argument.
I’m not sure, but I don’t think using someone for the sake of that kind of semantic gratification is all that different from using them for sexual gratification.
Okay? Boundaries. Keep your own.
1 Like
comma
Conversation over.
1 Like
gay, can’t say I’m surprised, his acting gay/bi in HoC was just too natural. As soon as I saw that I figured it was real. Too bad it has NOTHING TO DO with being a complete piece of shit if this is all true. As someone said on another post. I’ve been really really really drunk and really really really gay, but I’ve never molested a 14 year old.
5 Likes
I think that the fact that people are more willing to listen to and believe the victims’ accounts than they might have been in years past is encouraging, as is the fact that Spacey probably realized that an outright denial or casting doubt on this victim wouldn’t have been taken seriously so he didn’t attempt to do that.
Not that it excuses his criminal behavior in any way, but it really is possible (maybe even likely) that Spacey was telling the truth that he didn’t remember this specific assault. Especially if he’s a serial predator as has been rumored. I’ll bet those assaults all blend together.
9 Likes
As a homo sapiens I am biologically capable of eating and digesting the flesh of other homo sapiens, but society frowns upon such things thanks to these, um, arbitrary lines created by law.
11 Likes
That was my first thought. If someone told me I’d sexually assaulted them and I didn’t remember it, I would tend to think they were mistaken (that is, I’d be freaked out). What sort of life would I have lead that someone would say, “You sexually assaulted me” and I would think, “I don’t remember that, but I believe it.”
Not that Spacey is even necessarily being accused of sexual assault here. But his apology make it sound like he’s saying, “That certainly sounds like the sort of thing I would do.”
9 Likes
Do you have a perfect memory of everything you did 30 years ago?
If so, report to a research institute, because -that- would be an anomaly worthy of research.
Sounds to me like he said 'yeah, that could have happened, I was an asshole back then".
Don’t go expecting him to defend himself against unmade accusations. He responsed, and with much much more sentivity than I am used to seeing in these recent events. He’s not denying it, but he’s not saying he knows it happened just so, either.
I don’t disbelieve Rapp, but my memories of when i was 14 are not intact. Even the rape I suffered… don’t have all the details on hand. Should I?
If an adult sexually molested an eighth-grade boy, yes, I would expect him to remember that.
6 Likes
Of course I don’t. But, speaking as a recovering alcoholic, if someone came to me and said, “You groped me at a party 20 years ago. I told you to stop, but you kept doing it.” I would not say “I don’t remember doing that, but if I did, then I would owe you an apology, if it caused you any problems. I was drunk, and closeted at the time.” That might be my first instinct, as I said. I think that’s a self defense mechanism. But I would suck it up and say, “Oh my God, I am so sorry I did that to you. It was wrong. I am so, so sorry.” If they then follow that up with asking why I did that, then I could follow that up with a discussion of my alcoholism, making absolutely certain to make it clear that I was not meaning that to in any way excuse my actions, but merely to explain them. To be clear, to my knowledge, I’ve never groped anyone. I did, however, do some shitty things to people when I drank, not all of which I remembered doing. And this is how I apologized to them.
10 Likes
Ugh thank you for digging into the garbage that was that comment.
Is someone going to comment on the “maybe he wanted it and changed his mind” part?
3 Likes
…“I choose to live as a gay man.”
Thanks, Kevin, for handing the “Pray the Gay Away” folks a loaded gun.
4 Likes
The first thing I did was consider what I was doing twenty years ago, and whether I could plausibly deny an accusation. Now, I am pretty damned sure I didn’t do anything, but then again it is twenty years. I have forgotten a lot of stuff, so if someone were to claim that I did fondle him or her back then, especially if it was at a party, then sure I would doubt my own memory.
And that is what the kern of the statement is: he doesn’t remember. He doesn’t think he did do it, but it can’t be ruled out and if he did then he is sorry. So yeah, I am going to go with the old Latin motto: In dubio pro reo.
This “revelation” was well written, wide ranging, full of bombshells, and probably hashed out years ago in preparation for just such a disclosure.
And “I choose to live as a gay man” does the gay population no favors, either.
2 Likes
