Ariel Castro, who held 3 women captive in Cleveland, kills self in cell

[William_Holz]

@helenaglory

Did he? Which daughter are you talking about? He has five adult children, and they all seem to be in the “he is a monster” camp.

And the fact that they’re being watched by a lot of people and under tremendous social pressure to say just that clearly shouldn’t be factored in, right? It’s not like they risk screwing up their entire lives or social ostracism or death threats or anything.

I suspect this is a poor statistic, I’d advise not basing any actual opinions on it.

[helenaglory]

@technogeekagain

Note that recognizing that someone is a monster doesn’t necessarily exclude loving them, if they haven’t been a monster to you. And loving them doesn’t necessarily exclude agreeing that they should be removed from society for everyone’s sake.

I really didn’t know what IMB was talking about, because I had only seen his family say strongly negative things about him, without any qualifications. Clearly, I didn’t see everything. You’re completely right on all these counts.

@technogeekagain

I’d rather have seen him spend the rest of his life behind bars with no chance of parole, and I’d rather not have had him commit suicide in this way.

I agree that the circumstances of his death are problematic, and I would not have wished them upon him, but I can’t really say that I would have preferred any other possibility. Yes, he would have suffered more if he had spent a long life behind bars. But he could have made his victims suffer more as well. I can’t help myself from thinking that this might have been the best chance Amanda Berry’s daughter has at some sort of well-being. I don’t know if I’m right. I know there’s really no way for me to know if I am. I know I’m coming from a very emotional place. I’m not pleased that he’s dead, but I do have an overwhelming sense of relief.

@technogeekagain

What it does say to me is that we need to improve our ability to predict who’s likely to make such an attempt and delay them until they have had appropriate counseling. On that level, I agree, the system failed us (whether or not it failed him), and needs work.

We need to improve our ability to listen. This was not the first time that Ariel Castro was introduced to the system. There are two good overviews of Castro’s history at Huffington Post and Examiner. I’m not wild about those sources but it was hard to find all of these details collected.

He treated his ex-wife similarly to the girls he kidnapped. Strangely enough, she also escaped when a neighbor responded to her cry for help. There were plenty of other signs that something was up with this guy. Yet he drove a fucking school bus from 1991 to 2012. Two years after he was first arrested for domestic violence. For eight years after an incident where he left a child on the bus while he went to Wendy’s.

I don’t have issue with casting a critical eye on the circumstances of his death, or not delighting in his death. But the discussion of how the system failed Ariel Castro (or perhaps how that discussion is framed) just irks me. The system served Ariel Castro pretty well, at least up until six months ago.