Class intersectionality in gender identity

I’m thinking there is something here that is very class related and English about this. Their being on stage and earning good coin from comedy around their identity is perhaps good in a very incremental way. I question who does this speak to?

Full disclosure, their comedy doesn’t land for me.

Stephen Fry works in the same upper English realm and their humor seems rich and inspirational. More so the more you learn about their background as they offer personal insight outside of their comedic theatrical mask.

Personally I have found Hannah Gadsby to be transformative in the world of comedy and story telling. Hannah has presented an Australian voice and sense of humor to the world that is seldom matched.

About a trans person announcing a new name? No. I attend a 12 step meeting with a lot of other trans people. Every other week someone is announcing a new or modified name. None of these people are British or particularly privileged. And I don’t mean they keep changing their name. I mean a new person starts coming to the meeting, at first they maybe aren’t comfortable revealing their true selves to the group, and then it’s a process. Coming out, including the name, is a process for all trans people. And the UK isn’t exactly trans-welcoming right now. Also, Izzard prefers she/her pronouns, not they/their.


I’m talking from my experience and friends that are not making the money or have the status of ‘celebrity’. My comment has nothing to do with Suzy Izzard the person.

My jab against the English culture is only toward a specific economic and social class that some celebrities inhabit.

I apologise as I get this is a sensitive subject for many including myself.


I would disagree that there is much of a comparison to be made between Stephen Fry and Eddie Izzard beyond them both being British, funny and lovable (and in both cases quite intellectual).

Stephen Fry, as you imply is from privilege, but Eddie Izzard is sort of vaguely ‘middle’ class and much of his humour stems from middle-class preoccupations - the skit on french lessons and the stylish Italians on their scooter for examples.

As for his new announcement, I feel it can only be for the good. I feel he (she, now) was influential in advancing people’s attitudes to transvestism because his interest in cross dressing was delivered as a matter of fact, rather than part of his act (action transvestite notwithstanding) and people just accepted that due to his force of personality.


I don’t think you understand the British class system.

Neither Suzy or Stephen Fry are upper class, that requires being elevated to the aristocracy by the King, or having an ancestor who was. If Elon Muck moved to the UK it doesn’t matter how rich he is, he will only be middle class, and if he met a homeless person person begging on the street who was the Duke of Kidderminster, then that homeless person is his social superior.

Hopefully it is obvious that I oppose this system, but it is the one in place in the UK. I encourage the idea that homeless people should be treated far better than EM though.


I would like to respectfully disagree with your disagreement. No disrespect intended.

Thinking more about it, I reckon what I was getting at is the stage and the audience that performers and celebrities choose to play.

The English/British issue for me is that the idea of class is still important in their culture… “money can get you anywhere but it can’t get you into society”, that sort of bullshit.

Who plays before the (dead) Queen is there to represent something of culture but some are equal and some are just amusement.

“You can’t get the jesters anymore”

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Absolutely, none taken.

(Edit for spelling)


I don’t know why, but the optional-ness of that comma is very amusing to me. Now I’m wondering if there’s some obscure linguistics term for that sort of thing.


Me too!



That’s just how I would say it IRL.

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I still don’t understand what you meant when you said “I’m thinking there is something here that is very class related and English about this.” What are you referring to by “this”? Changing your name? Making a public announcement about a name change? Having a preferred name but being ok with people using your previous name? I’m not being snarky or argumentative. I honestly don’t understand what you meant.


seth meyers lol GIF by Late Night with Seth Meyers

Suzy Izzards comedy does land for lots of people. And yes, she certainly is a bit more privileged than others, as she’s been a successful performer for years. However, she’s long been public with her journey and is still incredibly brave to do so. It seems to me that public figures sharing their journey, especially if they have a fan base that is diverse, can help to raise awareness of the struggles of being trans for those of us who are not. She shouldn’t have to do that - no one should have to share parts of themselves to raise awareness of the struggles others in their community face - but as we’re staring down some serious targeting of the trans community, I appreciate what she is doing here.

You’re ignoring what has been foisted upon both of them - the fact that one is a gay man and one is trans, they are forced by our societies to be symbols for the communities that both are thought to represent. Lots of people who are in the public eye are not forced to do so… no one is expecting Patrick Stewart to represent all straight white British men, for example. They chose to be performers, they did not choose to represent entire swaths of people.

Thats Good Jada Pinkett Smith GIF by Red Table Talk


Well - you know - those queer people are all rich. Especially the trans ones. :wink:


Kenan Thompson Reaction GIF by Saturday Night Live


Ah yes, England is famous for how accepting their society is of trans people, second only to its love of taking in refugees. :confused:

It would be nice if announcing a new name could become a normal English thing, though.


It is. If you’re a straight person getting married.


All cool, no snark taken :grin:

What my point is (yes I know it’s not about me but I think this is a valid perspective) when I talked about ‘this’ specific instance of communication via popular media by a specific celebrity it means different things depending upon what ‘class’, in the Marxist sense, that a person communicates from.

For example the same gender related statement has different currency if it comes from the tabloid press, The Guardian, the church, Fox News, Royalty, pub landlord etc. etc.

Suzy becoming Suzy is great. But looking for aspiration from celebs says much about a culture that has given up on people of substance. Not saying Suzy doesn’t have substance, just not that aspirational in the context of many other non celebs who give so much in local communities.

Yet… you mis-gendered Izzard.


They all hate trans people, so I’m not sure what those different currencies are. Is it something like 1 Fox News Hate = 3 Guardian Hates = 10 Church of England Hates?

I thought she did a good job on the Labour Party NEC, despite my current opinion of the Labour party being “better than the Tories, worse than a punch in the mouth”.


The discussion you’re asking for is to politely debate whether or not someone’s gender identity is real or simply fashion. That is itself a weapon, one currently being used to attack some of society’s most vulnerable people. No apologies that we won’t have any part in it.