From Canada? Want to go to the U.S.A.? Better have the right vaccine

[SeamusBellamy]

Originally published at: From Canada? Want to go to the U.S.A.? Better have the right vaccine | Boing Boing

…

[mbaren]

Uh, no. 5 hours before you posted this story, this was already no longer true, sorry.

U.S. confirms it will accept Canadian travellers with mixed vaccines | CBC News

[teknocholer]

@SeamusBellamy

…many countries where vaccine mixing is considered to be a dangerous load of bullshit. You may have guessed by now, that America is one of those countries.

The policy in Canada was to get as many people to take the first jab as possible, and AstraZenica was the first available to everyone, not just senior citizens. Subsequent studies show that was the right decision, and the AZ/Pfizer combo, for one, seems to produce antibodies at least as effectively as the pure Pfizer/Pfizer shots.

@SeamusBellamy

I’d like to think that a crap load of data on the effectiveness of mixed vaccine dosing will play into such a decision.

That data exists. If you’re implying that the Canadian government cynically encouraged inferior vaccinations, I suggest you look beyond whatever is the flavour of the month at the CDC. This is all on the Americans, with their unique blend of medicine and politics.

So sorry you can’t warm your toes on a Texas beach.

[RickMycroft]

Moot now, but another solution might have been to look at who can currently get a third booster jab, and go for two of a kind.

[cannibalpeas]

@teknocholer

This is all on the Americans

I thought that’s what he was saying. He begins that paragraph by referencing the decision making by the CDC.

[mbaren]

That’s not really an option for the vast majority of Canadians.

[Doctor_Faustus]

@teknocholer

This is all on the Americans, with their unique blend of medicine and politics.

Not unique. The UK did the exact same thing, purely to anatgonise the EU, where mixed vaccination was also common.

[anon50609448]

Yes. No.

[alphaxion]

However, for a while the UK only recognised mixed-vaccine 2-dosers if they were administered in the UK.
Towards the end of Sept the UK changed this to now accept mixed doses from other nations; much to my relief as I had my first dose (AZ) in the UK and then promptly emigrated to Canada where I had my second dose (Pfizer) so I’m actually straddling the two.

Sadly, while the UK will let me back into the country if I wish to see family I believe Canada won’t let me back in since the UK hasn’t dropped below 30k new cases a day for months now. Apparently it appears to be children in school driving the infections, the UK needs to sort out its vaccine supply and get those kids vaccinated.

[ejeffrey]

@SeamusBellamy

one of many countries where vaccine mixing is considered to be a dangerous load of bullshit. You may have guessed by now, that America is one of those countries.

It’s not so much we considered it a dangerous load of bullshit is that we considered it untested. The US for all it’s faults did a pretty good job saying "we tested X so that is what we are going to do. We didn’t second guess the trial design once we saw the results.

But while it was not officially recommend to mix doses, basically everyone acknowledged that it was probably fine we just didn’t have data.

We are now beginning to get that data which is great.

[cheem]

I know a number of people who were able to do just that. Albertans, of course.

[SeamusBellamy]

Sorry. This one was written a few nights ago, but held in queue until now.

[SeamusBellamy]

Nope. I’ve nothing bad to say about the way things were done. The provinces wanted as many folks vaccinated as possible. It’s good health policy. Unfortunately, it led to some uncomfortable travel politics.

[Purplecat]

@alphaxion

Apparently it appears to be children in school driving the infections, the UK needs to sort out its vaccine supply and get those kids vaccinated.

Good news- over 12s became eligible for vaccination at the start of October (yeah, I know, far too late), so things are getting there.

Bad news - the UK is still getting absolutely hammered by the Delta variant, with case counts not really declining at the moment. The situation is being masked by just how effective vaccination is.

Here’s the population adjusted cases-

and population adjusted deaths for comparison-

Credit, as always to UK Coronavirus Tracker for the graphics.

[abutilon]

Seamus, good to hear from you! Hope you overwinter safe & warm. Also hope you will consider boycotting Texas. You may have heard…

[werdnagreb]

Not that I want to travel to the US right now, but it’s nice to have the option.

[llazy8]

@ejeffrey

is that we considered it untested

There’s a huuuuuge difference between not authorizing a certain vaccine brand or dosing scheme for your own population, and denying those who have taken it entry.
The US needs to deal with the reality that their horrid, horrid performance in this pandemic has nothing whatsoever to do with fully vaccinated people with, say, the Indian version of Astra Zeneca somehow infecting good old red, white and blue Pfizer people due to some notion of a percentage point of effectiveness, and everything to do with the total lack of a national strategy, the staggering number of adults who will not vaccinate and will not mitigate, and the political wedge the conservatives see in this whole, sad, debacle.
I have my two doses of Sinopharm up in there. And my family lives in Florida. If I were to visit them, who the fuck would be more likely to be transmitting the Rona to whom? Me, because the CDC hasn’t approved Sinopharm? Or the 50% of the state who refuse to get on the ball?
This ridiculous public health move is the thing that is angry-making. Even with the imaginary worst vaccine in the world, and a negative PCR test, anyone who came in to the US would be less likely to transmit covid to a yank than one of their neighbors. So the policy creates hardship just to do a little nationalistic jitterbug for the xenophobes and has no likely benefits to anyone beyond that.

[PsiPhiGrrrl]

@ejeffrey

It’s not so much we considered it a dangerous load of bullshit is that we considered it untested.

That’s probably the reason behind the travel industry guidelines (from last month):

Continuing coronavirus happenings (Part 3)

TIL that some countries and travel companies consider anyone who received a combination of different vaccines to be unvaccinated. Only those who had the manufacturer recommended dosage (including timeframe and waiting periods) fall into their “fully vaccinated” category. I’m not sure if it’s because they are waiting for more data on that scenario. However, it means more people will face restrictions in the future unless the criteria changes:

[ejeffrey]

@llazy8

There’s a huuuuuge difference between not authorizing a certain vaccine brand or dosing scheme for your own population, and denying those who have taken it entry.
The US needs to deal with the reality that their horrid, horrid performance in this pandemic has nothing whatsoever to do with fully vaccinated people with, say, the Indian version of Astra Zeneca

Which is exactly why the US is accepting any vaccine that is approved by the FDA or recommended by the WHO.

[llazy8]

So everyone except those who got the commie vaccines (Sputnik and Soberana). Sputnik was the first to roll out in my country because, while the government had made a huge deal with Astra Zeneca wherein we produce the active substance for their vaccine in the Astra Zeneca labs in-country, then ship to Mexico for finishing, then supply all of Latin America and get our population dosed in the meanwhile, Astra Zeneca royally flopped and left 45 million people high and dry. Gamalya actually delivered, so most of our over 50 and at-risk people got Sputnik.
Then, Gamalya ghosted us on the second dose, so there’s a ton of mix and match with Astra Zeneca, that finally began to supply our own vaccines back to us weeks before they expired.
But, BS like this US ruling, which is still based on what the WHO recommends for use within a country, is causing great uproar among the conservatives, who are blasting the government here for getting us the wrong vaccine and now we can’t go to Disneyworld and Miami and until Dec also can’t take a European vacation. It’s been a big deal and costing the progressive government a lot of cred for their pandemic response - “Look, they gave us a vaccine so shitty that I can’t even go on vacation with it!” People in the US don’t travel abroad much, but not being able to go to Miami or Barcelona is a devastating hardship for Argentine middle class people.
And honestly, bazillions of people worldwide have taken Sputnik for ages now, and each country has also done their own safety and efficacy testing to authorize its use, so it should not matter at all whether the WHO or CDC are satisfied with the minutiae of the Gamalya’s processes and if they’re ‘modern’ enough for fancy pantsy first world elites to put in their precious little arms. We would have had thousands and thousands more deaths if Sputnik hadn’t been rolled out. And now the conservatives are set to take power again, much based on the criticism of the vaccine strategy.
All this, when, the health issue in the US is not low-quality pinko vaccines and breakthrough infections - it is a rampaging wave of infections among the vaccinated.
Annoying.