I have the opposite experience. People who I thought were good, ordinary people with political views I disagreed with have revealed themselves to be wannabe fascists, in reality. Others, who I may not have liked as much personally, who voted for Trump, now find him disgusting. They realize their mistake, and maybe hate him even more for it.
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Well, isn’t that convenient.
it’s that some people like and want spades.
is flags and USA! USA! USA! because, as you say,
And, a lot of them actually want fascism.
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I tend to agree with you. It’s not just the would-be fascists who voted for Trump. Some are conspiracy theorists, and think he will deal with the deep state. Some are Conservatives who like some of Trump’s supposed policies. Some just hate Hillary more than Trump. Some feared Obama-I won a bottle of liquor from a family member who insisted that Obama would cancel the 2016 elections.
And, of course, SOME are authoritarian fascist racists. Some are just low-information voters.
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Much like the greater GOP party machine that has turned a blind eye to blatant racists running unfucking opposed in their name. Going oops no we don’t endorse them after getting called out does not count. The fact that they can’t bother run even a rabid weasel against these candidates tells me they are by omission the party of racist hatred.
If you voted for the orange shitgibbon just because you couldn’t deal with “oh heavens a human with a vagina in the oval office the end times are upon us”. Own the fuck up to what you voted for or shut the fuck up when you are called out on it.
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Sounds like a rational bunch open to having their minds changed if the bad ol’ liberal elites would just listen to them. Probably some “very fine people” in there.
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Im definitely not selling that stereotype, I live in San Francisco and the Republicans I know well are in a little beach a little to the north. As coastal as it gets, although with that in mind I’ve been fortunate to have the same experience with Republicans inland. Pretty much the only time I see Republican monsters is online or on TV.
And this whole thing makes me think of the way some pro Israel people argue that being against the foreign policy of Israel makes someone anti-semitic. Their tortured logical proofs remind me of the reasoning here.
All very well put. And I should mention that I’m by no means arguing that no trump supports are fascist. Just that not all of them are, and that merely voting for trump doesn’t on its own make someone fascist.
How so? Those pro-Israel people who make that argument are fallaciously implying that all Jews support the policies of the Likud (which said pro-Israel people fallaciously equate with the State of Israel), and that “therefore” any criticism of Netanyahu and his ultra-nationalist fundie allies (including those made by Jews) is anti-Semitic.*
What’s being argued here is simply that people who vote for a fascist candidate are to one degree or another complicit in supporting a fascist regime. Whatever their good-faith priorities (e.g. protecting their property rights, making sure the trains run on time), the muse Clio will see them as such and not look kindly upon them.
[* that some critics of Israel on the left and right do in fact use it as a beard for their anti-Semitism is a separate issue]
@DukeTrout below explains why you came off that way.
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Between your “echo chamber” comment and the gross assumption that the people disagreeing with you have never met a Real Republican™, are you really arguing in good faith, or just trying to rile people up?
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Besides the vagina, I know some people who think that the biggest, most important, horrific thing in the world right now is women’s right to legally terminate a pregnancy. Pretty much everything else can be accepted if it gets us closer to ending the embryo holocaust. I don’t agree with this perspective, but it makes some intrinsic sense.
And to be fair, some of them really struggle with having to support Trump in hopes that it might make abortions more deadly for women.
Some might say I maybe I wasn’t as fair as I could have been.
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Yes. some are fine people who simple hated Hillary a tad bit more than they hated Trump. But, no, they aren’t open to having their minds changed. They knew he was/is a scumbag. They also believed she was a scumbag. That doesn’t make them fascists or racists.
Which is why they’re write-offs, contrary to the arguments that the mean liberals (AKA the “reality-based community”) have to listen to them and convince them to see the light.
Correct. And in voting for him instead of sitting things out they are now complicit in supporting a fascist and racist administration.
Some additional points on dealing with those who are complicit with and still defending the regime from John Scalzi:
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But, that does make them Ok with it. In what world is fascism, racism, misogyny, bigotry, etc. all the things trump projected prior to the election, the lessor evil?
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In their world, the one between their ears.
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Yes. They are write-offs. They can’t be convinced. Fortunately, they are in the minority, even in states like Florida, Pennsylvania and Michigan. Hopefully, in 2020, the Dems will nominate someone who isn’t disliked by a majority of Americans.
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Still, voting for this president was a racist act and supporting him after everything is a fascist act.
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Anyone who is “okay” with fascism and racism because it helps them reach their own goal is still my enemy, as far as I’m concerned.
‘Opportunism’ is no excuse.
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Many of them don’t know what fascism is.
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Fine with me. As I said before, you aren’t going to convert them. So you might as well hate them.
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This is at the White House < what > Briefing? Oh, the White House Press Briefing?
How about, en masse, these “enemies of the people” leave the room, on the spot?
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