[quote=“marence, post:262, topic:94345”]
It was a weirdly oversampled statistical exercise, and done specifically to show that liberals are as insulated in their neighborhoods as neo-cons are in theirs.
[/quote]But the questions are pretty much aimed at upper-middle class white folks being the “high score,” I’m not understanding how it accomplishes its goal at all.
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Just stating the obvious about “what point they were trying to make” (emphasis mine.)
Studies don’t always do what they set out to; that’s one of the fascinating parts of social science. Or frustrating. Or both.
I was at the point where I was in complete despair about this whole idea of reaching out, but right now I’m listening to this Great Courses audio lecture on Communication and it is giving me some hope. In general I’ve become interested in communications recently, for a lot of personal and professional reasons.
Here’s the link.
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Standout quote:
"I’m all in favor of repealing it,” she said about Republicans’ push to do away with the Affordable Care Act, popularly known as Obamacare. But, she said when you talk about cutting Medicaid: “I don’t agree with that at all.”
Someone coach me on how to have a productive conversation with this supporter because the only two words I have right now rhyme with ‘duck zoo’.
I’d like to note that my phone had changed ‘duck’ to ‘fuck’. Autocorrect, I’m so proud of you right now.
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Here is a story I saw on Fox that is seems to have generated a lot of interesting conversations about free speech and partisan media:
Glenn Beck is left wing?
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He switched sides recently.
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They are saying “we (as the right) can’t be like the left, who as we all know is interested in removing free speech,” not that TheBlaze is left leaning.
There is a lot of people finding out people on the right are very much interested in policing speech and the responses get pretty heated between like-minded people.
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I guess I finally know who Tomi Lahren is. I’ve seen lots of people complaining about how awful she is recently.
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I’ve been doing a lot of reading and research on how to talk to people in a way that creates real communication. I found this very good book, which gives a technique for talking to people across differences.
The recipe for communication is:
- Observations (as opposed to judging)
- Feelings (just because you use the word feeling doesn’t make it a real feeling - it’s possible to use the English language in a way where you say “I feel that…” which goes into judgement; he has a long explanation of words to use and not to use)
- Needs
- Requests
So, for example:
When I learned that Trump’s proposed budget cut funding from Meals on Wheels, I am unsettled that our vulnerable senior citizens could be left without funding for their basic needs for food and companionship. I need to know that these elderly people will be safe from budgetary cuts. Can you please tell me what you are doing to make sure that this program is protected or that another program will cover the same benefits?
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I love this book!
And, your example is perfect.
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I like it very much. He takes a lot of the information I’m learning in the Communications course I’m listening to (from the Great Courses) and boils it down into actionable steps. I know it’s not as sexy and fun as pointing fingers and acting smug, but I think it’s worth trying to see if beyond the rhetoric we can find ways to discuss policy that are productive. If someone wants to believe Trump did it because that makes them feel good and the country is safe, I can live with that.
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I wholeheartedly agree. What other choice is there really?
I’ve looked at the Great Courses but haven’t tried any. What is it like?
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The Great Courses are overall very good. One of my professors at college, Professor Harl, is one of their popular teachers. Let’s just say, he’s the only professor, ever, that I saw get a standing ovation. He is amazing; like a one man encyclopedia on Ancient History. Honestly I find his audio a little tough to listen to because he is just soooo dense with his facts and footnotes and it’s hard to follow it all just with audio. His classes were incredible - the only person who brought all the people from history to life for me.
My husband gets a lot of their stuff and we often listen to the courses on long road trips. Most of them are great. Every so often there is one that is not so good. I bought the yoga one and was really disappointed with it - probably I just know too much, but honestly, for someone really new to yoga who is the kind of person who wants to understand things intellectually, it probably wouldn’t be a bad starting point even if a lot of it is not factually correct. There’s been a couple of others that feel “light” on the content. They have a streaming service now and I think you get a free month if you sign up. My library has a lot of their stuff, too, so that’s another way you can try them out.
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I don’t know. They’re not particularly nice to us, so why should we be nice to them?
I’ve been tone policed enough to know that no matter what I say and how I say it, I will be asked to tone it down.
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Because we are all in the boat together and they just voted a bunch of lunatics into office. Even if we get rid of Trump, we will still be left with DeVos, Tillerson, et al.
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I had a long discussion with one of my co-workers today about Trump. He’s a naturalized immigrant who is very conservative that voted for Trump because he wanted a conservative appointee to the Supreme Court. He figured he’d suffer through 4 (he jokes “more like 2”) years of Trump since a Supreme Court nominee is for far longer.
He had no idea about the recent fuckery going on around the EPA and environmental regulations being rolled back (“hey, I like the EPA. Wait, so it’s no longer illegal to dump mining chemicals into streams now?”) and to the rolling back of pro-consumer FCC regulations. This is what voting for Trump got you, pal.
For being such a smart guy he sure came off as a typical low-information voter. This is what we’re dealing with, folks.
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And don’t forget companies now getting the blessing to mine conflict minerals in Africa. Yay! death and misery for smart phone parts! Yippee! /s
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Precisely. We’re dealing with people who want one specific thing, and they don’t care who gets hurt in their pursuit of it.
But hey. That’s what you get when you support theocrats and people who put money ahead of justice. At least they’re not actively malicious folk like the Westboros- actually, they’re worse. The Westboros know they’re evil. And they are few. But these sleeping morons are many.
“But nobody gave me a leg up!”
“So that justifies supporting the murder, suppression, and starvation of black people?”
Some people cannot empathize. Fuck 'em.
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I can’t live with that.
The traditional way we internet leftists have engaged people is in writing long, well-linked essays. But there are limits to this logic-based manner: there are some issues in which the voter’s lizard brain cannot be overridden; on abortion, on immigration, on undocumented immigrants, on evolution, on LGBTQ* rights, etc. Faith is the substance of willful ignorance, the evidence of an unwillingness to be proved wrong. You cannot override their idiocy on those matters, no matter how hard you try. You’re welcome to, anyway.
Me, I was raised a right wing nut job, but my values were based around being a good person. On equality and fairness. On justice. Which is why I deconverted when I realized my religious peers did not match my values. They were Christianists, but they only took the hateful parts (“stone teh gays! and death to those who curse parents!”) and lived those. Brother, there is not a more hateful bunch than sincere Evangelicals.
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