navarro
October 3, 2020, 8:49pm
108
i understand what you’re getting at but remember that hilary got almost 3 million more votes than trump and was within 100,000 votes of obama’s 2012 results. the electoral college desperately needs reforming out of existence.
4 Likes
Wally
October 3, 2020, 8:50pm
109
I would add to your list something about supporting creativity and knowing that our contributions are for the greater good: that we each MEAN something. If all we are is wage slaves, serving some fat master somewhere, then what’s the fuckin point? Shoot me now. Life is to be lived richly, to have substance and vitality. We need the arts. We need richness and texture in our many-cultures-as-one.
If we are always being stomped on by authority, then that human spirit is lost. Police brutality. Economic uncertainty and inequity. Human rights being stripped away, lgbt rights being suppressed, racism, homophobia, sexism, ableism, bigotry, etc. The list goes on. Without a system geared towards innovation and uplifting individuals in a way that facilitates their creative contributions in society, then a system even with all the parts you listed is still a failure.
I guess you said entertainment, but I mean something deeper and more like “the arts and culture as a focus” not just pure entertainment.
5 Likes
navarro
October 3, 2020, 8:50pm
110
based on their actions and their rhetoric the republican party is totally against it.
11 Likes
Wally
October 3, 2020, 8:51pm
111
Of course. I mean we should be 20 million over. It really should be that much. And even in those red and purple states.
5 Likes
I like it. Basic human dignity, but with depth.
7 Likes
I wonder if you might find these ‘tests’ and the conclusions they lead to, of interest. Hopefully they will also be thought-provoking. They can help focus thoughts around many of the (rhetorical) questions others are posing for you further above.
Told me I match “Libertarian Socialism”. Is that a thing?
1 Like
prooftheory:
Libertarian Socialism
Libertarian socialism is an anti-authoritarian and anti-capitalist political current that emphasises self-governance and workers' self-management. It is contrasted from other forms of socialism by its rejection of state ownership and from other forms of libertarianism by its rejection of private property. Broadly defined, it includes schools of both anarchism and Marxism, as well as other tendencies that oppose the state and capitalism.
With its roots in the Age of Enlightenment, libertarian soc...
Google - and especially Wikipedia - are often your friends.
5 Likes
Yes, the current use of Libertarian in American discourse is the result of a right wing hijacking of the term.
9 Likes
Libertarian socialism is an anti-authoritarian and anti-capitalist political current that emphasises self-governance and workers' self-management. It is contrasted from other forms of socialism by its rejection of state ownership and from other forms of libertarianism by its rejection of private property. Broadly defined, it includes schools of both anarchism and Marxism, as well as other tendencies that oppose the state and capitalism.
With its roots in the Age of Enlightenment, libertarian soc...
The first anarchist journal to use the term libertarian was Le Libertaire, Journal du Mouvement Social and it was published in New York City between 1858 and 1861 by French libertarian communist Joseph Déjacque .
It is worth noting that French has two words for libertarian. Libertaire describes the left wing variety, and Libertarien is the right wing version.
9 Likes
Frankly, the wikipedia article doesn’t inspire much confidence in me that it is a thing either.
You must be a fast reader!
Did you get as far as Noam Chomsky?
2 Likes
Would some real world examples help?
Makhnovia (Russian: Махновщина Makhnovshchyna), also known as the Free Territory (Ukrainian: Вільна територія vilna terytoriya; Russian: Вольная территория volnaya territoriya), resulted from an attempt to form a stateless anarchist society during the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917 to 1921. It existed from 1918 to 1921, during which time "free soviets" and libertarian communes operated under the protection of Nestor Makhno's Revolutionary Insurrectionary Army. The area had a population of aro Makhn...
Korean People's Association in Manchuria (KPAM, August 1929 – September 1931) was an autonomous anarchist zone in Manchuria near the Korean borderlands, populated by two million Korean migrants. It was also known as Shinmin Prefecture or Korean Anarchist Federation in Manchuria. The society was constructed upon principles of stateless communism, operating within the framework of a gift economy based upon mutual aid.
Japan had invaded Korea in 1894, under the pretext of protecting Korea from Chin...
Revolutionary Catalonia (21 July 1936 – 1939) was the part of Catalonia (autonomous region in northeast Spain) controlled by various anarchist, communist, and socialist trade unions, parties, and militias of the Spanish Civil War period. Although the Generalitat of Catalonia was nominally in power, the trade unions were de facto in command of most of the economy and military forces, which includes the Confederación Nacional del Trabajo (CNT, National Confederation of Labor) which was the domina...
The Federation of Neighborhood Councils-El Alto (acronym: Fejuve; Spanish: Federación de Juntas Vecinales de El Alto) is a federalist mode of political organization of over 600 neighborhood councils that provide public services, construction and jobs to citizens of El Alto, Bolivia.
The first council was created in 1957 and was based on the traditional practices of the Aymara people and the need to respond to widespread poverty, corruption and violence throughout Bolivia and El Alto. Fejuve itse...
Rebel Zapatista Autonomous Municipalities (Spanish: Municipios Autónomos Rebeldes Zapatistas, MAREZ) are de facto autonomous territories controlled by the Neo-zapatista support bases in the Mexican state of Chiapas, founded following the Zapatista uprising which took place in 1994 and is part of the wider Chiapas conflict. Despite attempts at negotiation with the Mexican government which resulted in the San Andrés Accords in 1996, the region's autonomy remains unrecognized by it.
The Zapatista a...
That’s more than the Ayn-caps have managed.
8 Likes
Yep and the citation points to an article on anarchism as I would expect.
No. It just obscures the problem.
5 Likes
My guess is about 1% of the most sadistic least empathic people on the planet. Which probably translates to 50%+ of elected Republicans.
10 Likes
Not all libertarian-socialism is anarchism though
Defunct
De Leonism, also known as Marxism-De Leonism, is a Marxist tendency developed by Curaçaoan-American trade union organizer and Marxist theoretician Daniel De Leon. De Leon was an early leader of the first American socialist political party, the Socialist Labor Party of America (SLP). De Leon introduced the concept of Socialist Industrial Unionism.
According to De Leonist theory, militant industrial unions are the vehicle of class struggle. Industrial unions serving the interests of the p...
Defunct
Council communism is a current of communist thought that emerged in the 1920s. Inspired by the November Revolution, council communism was opposed to state socialism and advocated workers' councils and council democracy. It is regarded as being strongest in Germany and the Netherlands during the 1920s.
Council communism emerged in the years after 1918, as some communists in Germany and the Netherlands concluded that the Russian Revolution had led to power being concentrated in the han...
Impossibilism is a Marxist theory that stresses the limited value of political, economic, and social reforms under capitalism. As a doctrine, impossibilism views the pursuit of such reforms as counterproductive to the goal of achieving socialism as they stabilize, and therefore strengthen, support for capitalism. Impossibilism holds that reforms to capitalism are irrelevant or outright counter-productive to the goal of achieving socialism and should not be a major focus of socialist politics.
Im...
Libertarian socialism is an anti-authoritarian and anti-capitalist political current that emphasises self-governance and workers' self-management. It is contrasted from other forms of socialism by its rejection of state ownership and from other forms of libertarianism by its rejection of private property. Broadly defined, it includes schools of both anarchism and Marxism, as well as other tendencies that oppose the state and capitalism.
With its roots in the Age of Enlightenment, libertarian soc...
7 Likes
That was a good chunk of my complaint about the Wikipedia article. It included enough relatively independent lines of thought that it didn’t actually seem to form a coherent “thingness” about it. To me the basic essence of the word “libertarian” is “private property and minimal state” and the basic essence of the word “socialism” is “public property”. Regardless of how other people define those words the two concepts that I’ve described here don’t go together and while I can see that “minimal state” and “public property” might go together, I don’t really think the term is a very good one and the fact that it applies to an incoherent group of ideologies doesn’t help.
At any rate, I’m not a libertarian socialist. I don’t believe in programmatic minimalism of the state or exclusively in public property.
Except libertarian did not always mean pro private property. That’s the current American use but not the historical use.
It’s not an oxymoron to use an older term in its original form.
8 Likes
When Joseph DeJacque called himself a libertarian, it was long before the capitalist ideology would take the same name. Back then it was called liberalism. Ayn Rand wouldn’t be born for 45 years.
Europe is still fighting to keep libertarians left wing even if that battle has been lost in the US. The White Overalls Movement Building Libertarian Effective Struggles were not capitalists.
7 Likes