He sounds offended.
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AFAIK the nude hikers didnât call anyoneâs beliefs arse.
Itâs us here in the BB forum calling stupid superstition arse. And itâs our lounge.
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As they say; actions speak louder than words.
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what? where?
are you arguing apples and oranges? this isnât a site with specific rules to protect the site. this was the middle of nowhere, just them.
yeah, i get that we all have different ideas about this sort of thing, and go into this in detail in my previous reply. this is exactly why it is wrong to take away the rights of another because of your personal beliefs or tastes. Your time and place is not anther personâs time and place. For some the time and place is atop a mountain, apparently.
Making an argument completely out of context makes for a silly argumentâŚthey arenât letting these people leave the country and are threatening them with retaliatory actions for causing an earthquake because they offended a mountain with their naked bodies while they were alone in nature. They didnât cause the earthquake this is a fact. The mountain isnât capable of being offended, this is a fact. The mountain isnât part of any culture. These people were alone except for their guide. It is just a subset of this culture that even holds this superstition. People in this country relieve themselves all the time near this mountain, exposing their parts to the mountain. I call BS on your crying cultural sensitivity.
i get nitpicking for the sake of arguing, and you are free to continue doing so. there were a lot of big points though, and addressing those would make for more interesting conversation. also making huge and mistaken assumptions about what other people think that are in direct contradiction to what they are saying is kinda poor form, imho.
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Quite. And the actions of the Malaysian authorities are heard loud and clear.
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Lots of points here, so Iâm going to break up your post, even though I know that can be annoying.
they arenât letting these people leave the country
That seems fair. If theyâre going to be charged with a crime, you donât really want them scarpering. You donât have to agree with the rule, but the way theyâre enforcing it is fine. Indonesia, for example, executes drug trafickers. I think thatâs a really bad and dumb idea, but I donât get to chose to ignore the rule when Iâm travelling in Indonesia and if caught I wouldnât expect to be able to leave just because I really really wanted to.
threatening them with retaliatory actions
Again, you donât have to like it, but they donât get to pick and chose what the rules are. Enforcing the rules is fine.
causing an earthquake
Scientifically silly, for sure.
because they offended a mountain with their naked bodies while they were alone in nature.
âalone in natureâ is irrelevant.
They didnât cause the earthquake this is a fact.
Sure.
The mountain isnât capable of being offended, this is a fact.
Agreed, but with trivial effort youâll find exactly the same kinds of rules everywhere.
The mountain isnât part of any culture. ⌠It is just a subset of this culture that even holds this superstition.
Ahh ⌠do you want to try that again? 
I call BS on your crying cultural sensitivity.
Oh, I can be a cultural buffoon with the best of them. But I do try to be respectful when I know what the parameters are, even if it means just going through the motions. Apart from anything else, different takes on culture are what makes the world so interesting. Homogenous culture is just flat out fucking boring.
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So, a visiting German shouldnât join in a protest at the Westboro Baptist Church headquarters? One shouldnât travel to a politicianâs popular stronghold to express negative comments about the candidate? A western woman shouldnât travel to a small village in Pakistan to express opposition to how the women and girls there are treated?
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Realistically she is likely to be in trouble. I personally doubt the Malaysian courts will buy the ânudity caused earthquakeâ theory but they are not going to be happy about the pictures. Its against the law, that sort of thing. I donât think the WNBR has a KL ride.
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Oh, certainly. I was merely addressing the assertion that one shouldnât call BS on peopleâs beliefs in the places those people live. It would be very dangerous in some situations, but it isnât wrong.
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It makes more sense than the claim that gay people marrying causes earthquakes, which American âgovernment officialsâ have definitely claimed. sooooâŚridiculous, but not USA ridiculousâŚ
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So, these tourist stripped down out of respect?
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Iâll just restate once again. They didnât cause an earthquake. They werenât nude in public. They were nude in a private remote wilderness location among themselves.
I think we partially agree on this. I donât think enforcing such rules is fine. I understand it happens. I think it is a human rights violation. Do human rights violations still happen all over the world, yes. Is it okay that it happens, no. Should we be defending them or speaking out against them? apparently we disagree on that oneâŚ
no, that is in private, that is what the alone part implies. in private doesnât mean within 4 walls and closed doors. Like i mentioned previously, many people in this area relieve themselves in this wilderness area, exposing their bits âto the mountainâ. The mountain isnât offended by them, nor are they being charged with anything. What is the difference between them and these tourists?
There isnât a rule about being naked on that mountain because it will be offended. If there was a posted rule at the mountain and they did it anyway, then maybe a fine is in order. This would be a different conversation if that was what was happening. It isnât. Nor were they naked in a public setting, again they werenât. they are being blamed with offending a mountain and causing an earthquake.
sure. a mountain doesnât have any culture or any emotions, it is a part of nature, as are naked bodies. 
being naked in front of a mountain isnât being naked in public.
I do as well. I donât think that respecting a culture means agreeing with or even allowing every aspect of every subculture to impose its beliefs onto other people at the expense of their basic human rights though. Slavery was widely accepted in southern US culture. Cannibalism has existed in a number of cultures. Human rights abuses have existed in a number of cultures, but that isnât a free pass for that kind of behavior. Basic human rights trump cultural biases, imho. If they donât then i think it is a perfectly reasonable response to speak out against and try and change that aspect of a culture. culture is malleable and is better for being shaped in a way that ensures basic human rights and freedoms.
Fully agreed.
Speaking of less boring⌠Personally, I think that nudity should be publicly acceptable. nudity is our natural state as animals. i personally think it is crazy, that people have an issue with nudity, but i they are free to have their opinions about it whatever way they want, just like I am. Where I think it is wrong, is trying to enforce those opinions onto others. i think it is just as wrong to force a person to be nude as it is to force a person to wear clothes, except situations where there are health or safety considerations that would affect others. There is nothing wrong with nudity. Nudity is not wrong, or harmful, or shameful, or amoral.
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I thought that part was obviously a joke in the context of the following âŚORâŚscience and stuff.
apparently I overestimated peopleâs humor detectors, as you are the second person to make that mistake.
I donât think that they were trying to respect or disrespect the mountain, or that the mountain had any opinion about what they did, or that it was in any way related to the earthquake.
Whether it was disrespectful or not, the Deputy Chief Minister officially blaming a fatal earthquake on naked tourists is either crazypants and/or pandering to superstitious locals.
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There is, however, a rule that says: DO NOT SHOUT, SCREAM or CURSE the mountain at any point of time.
Lakes donât have them either, but even New Zealand has âno useâ lakes and mountains that are perpetually âtapuâ. A lake that has had someone drown in it can also be placed under temporary tapu until the body is recovered and it has been blessed.
The difference is that the former tapu is protected by iwi (tribal) ownership and backed by Crown law on trespass; the latter by local respect for our indigenous culture. If you go swimming in temporarily tapu waters youâll get growled at and asked to go away.
So my take? Stupid, bad-mannered tourists. Over-reaction by local authorities.
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lol. you can glare at it and mutter under your breath thoughâŚ
uh oh, i think you just broke the first rule of fight club. 
(interesting read though, thanks!)
Iâm not advocating trampling over peopleâs customs. Iâd respect such restrictions personally when visiting, unless someoneâs life was in danger or there was another overriding consideration. If broken Iâd expect reasonable repercussions, like a trespassing fine, or being prevented from returning to the area, etc.
i fully agree.
I reserve judgment. Simply being naked doesnât imply being rude, disrespectful, or being stupid. It doesnât rule those things out thoughâŚand it might be a reasonable response to ask them not to come back. i donât think blaming them for the earthquake is in order though, nor restricting their ability to leave the country so that they can be brought to court on charges of creating a devastating earthquake resulting in multiple deaths which is a mandatory death penalty level charge in malaysia. (note: i donât agree with capital punishment, and never think it is justified, but especially not when the people had absolutely nothing to do with the natural disaster that caused the deaths.)
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Malaysia is a pretty conservative SE Asian country with a large muslim Malay population, a smaller (also socially conservative) mixed buddhist and christian Chinese population and a variety of other minority cultures in the mix. I think it safe to say that anyone who either didnât know or didnât bother to read up on what the behavioural standards expected in public are like, is indeed bad mannered. Plus, (top tip!) keeping your clothes on and your junk covered is a pretty safe bet in most places, so stripping off when you donât know itâs OK is indeed fair to describe as stupid. Do it in your own home, a nudist colony or a beach set aside for it, feel free.
I canât disagree that the charges are stupid and likewise Iâm anti death penalty. It wonât happen though. Malaysia has had a bad run recently so this will almost certainly disappear quietly.
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It may well have been. Revealing ones self as a human being in the face of a natural wonder may be seen as honoring the natural world and oneâs relationship to it. But try telling that to a culture that is centuries behind the modern world. These people may be hanged, or may be caned so that they are permanently scarred. We should not be laughing when their lives are at risk.
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i hope you are right and the charges quietly disappear. I fear that is an easier thing to do to the tourists. 
iâve made the argument that they were alone in nature except for their guideâŚbut that is rather a side argument to this discussion.
a fine for being naked is one thing, and iâd probably shrug that off as humans being weird about our own bodies. being held responsible for an earthquake and multiple deaths is a whole different thing in malaysia and i fear for their safety, and not just from the government.
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Am I just trading in cultural imperialism and imposing my occidental-hegemonic concepts of âempiricismâ and âtrying not to sound totally stark raving mad while exercising authorityâ; or is it pretty weird for an actual Malaysian state official to be making the âoffending the sacred mountain caused earthquakesâ claim, rather than sticking to the much safer territory of âFFS, tourists, try not to be too obnoxious while you are here, pleaseâŚâ?
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