I was writing in response to a person who said that not having children was the way to reduce climate change. I don’t like people who preach to others that they shouldn’t have kids based on some kind of philosophical point. If you are against humans existing, I have trouble not thinking, “Hey, you first.”
I’m anti-antinatalism, and I’m anti-antiabortion, but I not criticizing anyone who has or does not have children. (Some of my best friends are people who did or did not have children)
Really happy people here are questioning that headline. It’s very tough to make determinations like that. Obviously an organic cotton bag consumes a lot more water than making a single-use plastic bag, but how important is water usage? It depends and it’s not always a simple answer. It is also good to understand, organic doesn’t mean better, and this does point out how much more water a water-intensive crop like cotton takes to go organic, and organic might not be better for that. The advice at the end is best: use whatever you have until it wears out. That’s what I do, and when I have to buy something, it’s those woven poly reusable bags.
Maybe it’s true in some places. In my city in the midwest, though, all our trash goes to a single landfill ten miles south of town. I agree it’s a good idea to reduce plastic use dramatically, especially single use things like bags and straws, but lets be real, none of the bags or straws used here ever get within 800 miles of an ocean. The idea that cutting back on plastic bags in Columbus, Ohio will in any way help marine life is plainly absurd.
There’s no mutually exclusive point of view here. The idea that having lots of kids will somehow reduce human suffering doesn’t make any sense to me. Having less children, especially less rich country children, will reduce carbon output significantly, lessening suffering for the 9 billion people that will have to deal with a much less forgiving (to human life) planet. Cutting back on reproduction by those that are willing to forego that for a greater good won’t extinguish the human race, don’t fret.
I heard a story recently about a researcher who studied the amount of microplastics in the extreme headwaters of high mountain lakes and streams - places that could not possibly be contaminated due to their remoteness and, indeed, they found plastics there as well. Such things as microfiber jackets or tents and backpacks from hikers can be contributing to the problem.
Oh come on now. I was supposed to think about the reasonable consequences of what you suggested instead of going hog wild on philosophy? What kind of world is this?!?
Fair enough. I can see how the decision to not have kids to reduce your carbon footprint could be seen as an implicit condemnation of people with kids. Which isn’t right.
The Malthusian myth keeps coming back to life no matter how many times it seems to be dead and buried.
Malthusianism is currently gaining popularity among millennial and Gen Z fascists as they think it justifies their genocidal beliefs. To the Malthusians reading this: Be critical of your own beliefs and be aware of where they could lead.
Its not science, its only a consideration of water, pesticides use, etc. and no one says you have to use organic cotton. Why not a nice nylon bag?
It’s also
Besides the fact that water pollution in Ohio, hurts humans in Ohio, you don’t have to have your ankles wet to affect the oceans.
It’s probably not the hikers that are doing the worst here.
I purchased a bunch of ripstop Baggu-style bags and have never regretted it. Gave away half to my boss’s wife who is a plastic hoarder of the worst kind. I make multi-store shopping trips every three weeks in the nearest metropolis of 35,000 for groceries and secondhand needs, and require a multitude to carry my purchases.
It is not possible to count on a store having cardboard boxes ready when they demand that their employees bust and bale them ASAP: stores sell that cardboard to recyclers.
Any second hand store will have reusable bags for sale these days. Buy one and help the environment. If you have a sewing machine or a handy friend who does, patterns are available online for making an excellent bag from a secondhand T-shirt, and you may even be able to choose your own graphics.
View one postmortem pic of a bird or dolphin choked to death on discarded bags, and you will never want another piece of plastic waste.
I suspect that the point Mr. D wanted to make is that showing off your hipster lifestyle by purchasing the organic etc bag is wasteful conspicuous consumption of the worst sort. Backfired like a mistuned jalopy.
I’m curious if you understand where the Scioto River ultimately ends?
The Gulf of Mexico, AKA - the ocean.
The main reason that San Francisco was a leader in banning plastic bags had little to do with the environmental impact of the plastic production. The plastic bags clog up the recycling sorting machines, causing more of the recyclables to have to be dumped as garbage and undoing all the work (and energy) used in sorting and cleaning out recyclables. Despite a big messaging campaign, people simply can not stop putting them in the single recycling bins. I have many sincerely environmentally sensitive friends who can not stop doing it, and there are many more who just never thought about it.
It is much better to put plastic bags into the garbage than to put them in your curbside recycling.
Perhaps it’s slightly better to put them in the grocery store plastic bag recycling bin, but I don’t even bother with that, just put them in the garbage since:
Learned something! Thanks! Looked up lede in the OED:
Etymology: Altered spelling of lead, originally in order to distinguish the word’s use in instructions to printers from printable text.
None of that crap is going on barges.
Fine. Occasionally a plastic bag will blow into the river, where it will wash ashore a couple miles down stream and be picked up by some dude doing community service for a DUI. The chance that a plastic bag from here will make it all the way to the ocean and hurt a sea turtle or whatever is infinitesimally small.
I don’t even like plastic bags! We should absolutely stop using them. But the argument against them is the argument against plastics in general and single-use plastics in particular. They produce a lot of waste that doesn’t biodegrade, greenhouse gases, etc. But telling people hundreds of miles from the ocean that they should stop using plastic bags to save marine life hurts the environmental movement because it sounds so damn stupid and implausible.
Suggesting that voluntary reductions in carbon output by individuals by limiting reproduction (which is just one of many measures that can and need to be taken to rein in a current catastrophe in progress) is the equivalent of Malthusianism, and fascistic, is a bit hyperbolic. It’s kind of like saying reducing one’s energy use and other behaviors that impact their carbon footprint is a war on the rest of society because it will slow the economy.
I have worked part time bagging groceries for a year and a half now so let me take this opportunity to share some suggestions for using reusable bags:
It’s also interesting that the OED says the word was used in the 1950s. It probably wasn’t used as the full phrase. No one’s ever been able to find a journalist or anyone using the phrase spelled as “burying the lede” before the 1970s into the 90s. It was always called “the lead” before that. It’s kind of a romantic anachronism. Any way, “lead” is just as good and correct.
Keep the bags and ditch the car. I get so frustrated when we debate marginally useful tactics.
We can do more than one thing.
If someone poops in your swimming pool, you don’t stay quiet just because it’s not going to reverse climate change all by itself to complain.
