Do you mean (1) vaping, and (2) living in a city that bans things like vaping? Yes, there is certainly an alternative. Don’t do either.
1 Like
Yeah but then there’s the ones who start with vaping then switch to cigarettes. 
3 Likes
I worry about all the kids who want to go to vape jam 2020. What’ll be left for them now after everything they’ve worked so hard for is taken away?
My grandfather was an occasional (not habitual) pipe smoker, and he said similar things about that.
I’m surprised this sort of first-hand testimony is getting such a negative reaction. I don’t smoke, I don’t vape, I never have, but it seems pretty reasonable that there would be some sort of upside, some sort of benefit, otherwise why would so many people put up with so many big, obvious negatives for so long?
4 Likes
Government mandates are required as long as smokers and vapers feel entitled to poison the people around them.
As the saying goes your right to swing your fist through the air stops at my nose.
1 Like
It’s called addiction for a reason. Apply your logic to heroin. The heroin high is described by the (former) users I know as the „f-ing best feeling in the world“. Who doesn’t want to experience that?
On topic: Banning vapors but not cigarettes isn’t helping the “victims” - secondhand smokers and kids.
I would say: let adults decide if they want to vape/smoke themselves, but ban smoking in any public situation, so people who don’t want to be affected by the proven dire consequences of secondhand smoke are protected and kids can’t add big puffy white vape clouds to there repertoire of coolness.
So smoke/vape in your car or house but not at the cramped bus stop when it’s raining.
Smokers defending their right to smoke in public among non smokers always reminds me of those “freedom of speech” hate-speach defenders from the yellow baboon brigade.
2 Likes
In San Francisco? They like to still pretend they are the hippie capital of the world!
1 Like
I mean, I guess people who do heroin, too, go on and on about the “upsides” of the drug…
2 Likes
Because they’re hooked on an extremely powerful drug.
6 Likes
Good to know. Since there has never been a single study demonstrating that cigars, pipes, or cigarettes - let alone e-cigs - “poison” or cause health problems in bystanders in open-air environments, I am sure we can agree that vapes should not be banned in open-air public spaces?
Or do you feel that the government should be allowed to ban whatever it - or the mob - wants, without the burden of proof, evidence, or cause?
There is this little concept I happen to fond of. It’s called “tolerance”. Some feel it is the basis for a maximally-free society. I am one of those people, so I get a little bristly when people start using the principle of tolerance to deny the freedoms of other people. Like you just did.
And it seems pretty rich to me to object so strongly to the supposedly unhealthy exhalations of a few people who are vaping on a city street, where we are all subjected to engine exhausts, cooking exhausts, noise pollution, people wearing strong perfume, rubber and plastic microparticles, pollen from municipal plantings.
But what do I know? According to some here, I am just an addict looking like an idiot when vaping. That’s not exactly “woke”, so maybe we should just ban it, so we won’t have to be disturbed if we see it.
3 Likes
Actually the last time I researched this, at similar distances a running car exposes a person to higher levels of carcinogenic particulates than a cigarette. So someone smoking on a sidewalk next to a street is creating significantly less danger than the cars driving past. It just is more annoying since the smell is easily identifiable (and rare). Ecigs are clearly much less dangerous than cars, but again can be more annoying due to the visible water vapor and flavoring. If you drive a car but eschew secondhand ecig vapor you may be blinded by your own addictive smoking habit.
3 Likes
Except that vapers get criticized for starting up a nasty habit, whereas heroin addiction is called an “epidemic”, as if you could contract it from a sneeze, or an unwiped doorknob.
They heard it was old school like vinyl records…
2 Likes
My 14 year old is surrounded by kids vaping at school, it is nearly universal (I am not exaggerating). No idea how many of those kids will graduate to actual cigarettes later on, but it is a serious thing at the grade 8-12 level. My kid has tried it as well.
No idea how to solve that issue, but massive penalties for people who sell to kids would be a fine start. Prohibition generally just makes things worse.
2 Likes
Patches were completely ineffective for me. They were too passive. I needed an activity to mimic smoking to help my psychological addiction to cigarettes which e-cigarettes provided. The problem with smoking is that the act of smoking is so much a part of it.
2 Likes
3 Likes
Under normal conditions water vapor is not visible.
The clouds emitted by vaping machines are composed of other chemicals.
2 Likes
True.
Taint perfect, just appreciated.
1 Like
Nicotine IS addictive, but not all things that work in that pathway are per se. Sex, for instance. Food.
@anon61221983
Epidemiologist here: “disease & injury” is a far broader category than “infectious disease” (e.g., diabetes, Tay-Sachs, itai-itai, generalized anxiety disorder, melanoma, etc. are all diseases sans infectious pathogens). “Epidemic” is simply a lay term meaning “more of a specific disease or injury in a population than we expect or accept”. In the public health literature vaping is indeed described using the term “epidemic”, as is cigarette smoking, and yes, heroin addiction.
4 Likes
