Student's awesome non-apology for wearing leggings

[Ignatius]

@anon61833566hunter

My position still stands. She doesn’t get to arbitrarily choose which rules she wants to follow. None of us do. And I still feel more information is required to come to a reasonable conclusion.

Eh, I kind of feel like if you get to arbitrarily make rules that affect me, I have some leeway in arbitrarily breaking them.

@Uncascrooge

The one great lesson that I learned from resisting misinformed rules in school was to save my resistance efforts for the things that really mattered.

Who gets to make the decision as to what really matters? I’d be shocked if Chloee wasn’t aware there might be consequences (AKA a more intense sequel to the ridiculous BS she was already dealing with). I think it’s reasonable that she get to decide which arbitrary and indefensible rules are important for her to break. She is the one dealing with the fall out, after all. But, hey, maybe someone can convince her that there was a better arbitrary rule for her to break. I have the sneaking suspicion that she would have simply broken two arbitrary rules instead.

@aikimo

How, exactly, does one “earn” the right to wear a particular type of clothing on one’s legs?

Supposedly you have earned your right to bagpipes when you have learned to pipe twelve songs. I think there’s an equivalent for pants. When you have learned to pull off ensembles involving 6 completely different types of pants, you earn the right to leggings. Not quite there yet, myself. My legs make the shorter shorts difficult to master.

Though I suspect by “earn” Quori meant “show a predilection for making fashion choices which the school agrees is appropriate.” Thus totally defeating the purpose of Quori suggesting a choice in fashion is earned.

@gregg_grose

A social media post is fine but I don’t see any true change taking place because of it.

In practical terms, we have no idea who posted the photo online. For all we know, the whole thing (other than the form itself, which I suspect is real) is a fabrication. I invite you to try making change the way you suggest, though. As an adult, I have done the adult equivalent in getting changes to my government to occur. I can guarantee you the snarky home printed signs I used to put in the rear window of my car were more effective.

Sure, they didn’t end the Bush administration abuses but neither did pestering my elected officials. The form letters I got back from my representatives were pretty clear evidence that going that route did nothing.

[Jardine]

@Ignatius

Eh, I kind of feel like if you get to arbitrarily make rules that affect me, I have some leeway in arbitrarily breaking them.

[calocke]

I didn’t say she was showing her crotch. I said the rule was about not showing crotch, as opposed to the rule being about slut-shaming.

@aikimo

stupid rules deserve to be ignored and mocked. It’s what thinking people do.

Oh, I apologize. I thought the right thing to do would be to ask questions or petition to change the rules. Not to be such a dick that you get thrown out of class.

[Ignatius]

@calocke

I didn’t say she was showing her crotch. I said the rule was about not showing crotch, as opposed to the rule being about slut-shaming.

Then why not make the rule about that?

@calocke

Oh, I apologize. I thought the right thing to do would be to ask questions or petition to change the rules. Not to be such a dick that you get thrown out of class.

That method is demonstrably ineffective in a society currently enamored with authoritarian bureaucracy and with its own virgin-whore dichotomy. Going through the channels built by power in order to convince that power accomplishes nothing. Otherwise, the power wouldn’t have built those outlets. They would have built less effective outlets instead.

I grow tired of people maligning the protesters for their methods. Sure, certain actions are wrong (possibly even objectively wrong) and mostly shouldn’t be done even if they are effective protest.

Neither breaking an arbitrary rule nor writing a snarky response when called on it qualifies.

[anon49215997]

Let them wear burqas.

[aikimo]

@calocke

I didn’t say she was showing her crotch. I said the rule was about not showing crotch, as opposed to the rule being about slut-shaming.

Then what’s the point of a rule against wearing leggings?

@calocke

I thought the right thing to do would be to ask questions or petition to change the rules. Not to be such a dick that you get thrown out of class.

How do you know she was being a “dick?” Just because she broke the rules? Does ignoring stupid rules automatically make one a “dick?”

The “right” thing to do about stupid rules depends on the situation. Of course, people who create or happily enforce stupid rules aren’t generally responsive to “asking questions” or “petitioning to change” the rule.

Ignoring the rule is a perfectly reasonable response to a stupid rule.

[cbhaughn]

Brave poor little kid student dePRIVED of her education by evil unthinking adult DESPOTS! tears tears tears tears… Such courage and élan exhibited in the very TEETH of cold unfeeling establishment policies. Cheer for the lost little girl with her leggings flapping in the wind. One more victim of savage bureaucracy.

The dress code is not Mrs. Rodgers’ dress code. It is the school dress code. As Google engineers are obligated to abide by the standards and practices of Google, as doctors are obligated to abide by the standards and practices of the hospitals to which they are attached, as burger flippers are obligated to abide by the standards and practices of the local McDonalds, Mrs. Rodgers legally and morally bound to uphold the standards and practices of the school. There is no separate dress code police. Teachers do all that, from planning lessons, to grading papers, monitoring the bathrooms, sequencing instruction, coaching, recording grades and attendance, making copies, maintaining discipline, checking for gum under the desks… There is no one else to do that. Teachers run the schools.

Mrs. Rodgers cannot unilaterally decide that she is going to teach math today instead of science. She cannot decide that she is not going to grade papers and dump them in the circular file. She cannot decide she is not going to enforce school rules. She cannot decide she is not going to enforce the dress code, or if she does she will have to find employment somewhere that does not require those kinds of things, perhaps Wal-Mart, or Google.

There is no evidence to suggest that Mrs. Rodgers thinks that wearing leggings is more important than getting an education. Ms. Britt decided to wear leggings to school knowing that it was in violation of her school’s dress code. She further states that she is going to continue to wear leggings to school knowing that it will have further negative consequences on her education and her future. This might be excusable in a head-strong 2nd grader, but a high school student should be well beyond this kind of futile display. Ten years from now it will not matter what she wore to school. What will matter is what she should have been learning in Mrs. Rodgers’ class.

So maybe the school’s dress code is stupid. Why have a dress code at all if students are only there to learn?
Left to their own devices, many, probably most students would do just fine without a dress code. A minority would begin to compete to see who could be the most outrageous, sexist, homophobic, misogynistic, provocative, racist, or violent, kid on campus. Random behavioral outbursts would occur as one student or another objected to what some other student was wearing. Parents and visitors would storm the principal’s office demanding answers. Less time teaching, more time putting out brush fires. If you don’t have dress codes you have these kinds of problems. We don’t have time to teach Pythagoras today. We’re learning how to get along.

What’s the deal with leggings anyway? I live in Florida. Haven’t seen leggings in years. Put on leggings here and you’ll sweat your butt off before you leave the house. Kind of stupid when you think about it. They’re like extra pants on top of your pants.

Okay, so whatever. Chloe wants to wear leggings. How is that going to hurt anybody, even if they are kind of dumb? Maybe the school has an answer for that, maybe they don’t. Maybe Mrs. Rodgers was just mistaken when she said leggings were prohibited.

Whatever the reason, I can’t help but think that it would have been wiser for Ms. Britt and/or her parents to approach the school and ask for an explanation of the policy rather just show up for school and be put in detention. In most high schools there are any number of organizations that have a significant influence on things like dress codes: students councils, PTAs, service clubs, even individual students can usually get in to see the principal or dean on matters like these.

Or maybe Ms. Britt just wanted to butt heads with the powers-that-be. Okay, fine. She did that. Show’s over. Move on.

[Kimmo]

@llamaspit

Really? You see anarchy as the alternative to not having to do the required public penance for a minor infraction of what may be an arbitrary rule… Seems like a bit of a false choice to me.

Hey, can we not abuse the term anarchy by using it as a synonym for chaos please?

…come to think of it, I was lazy with chaos there.

[Bobo]

SWEET MOTHER OF GOD!!! SOMEONE HAD BOOBS AND THE WORLD DIDN’T END!?!

I realize that I’m probably in the minority in this, but I’m always a little confused how a simple tit can throw everyone for a loop here in the States. I mean, I like them as much as the next hetero guy, but if one flops out in public, who gives a rat’s ass? Oh no, Janet Jackson’s boob on TV? Meh. I’ve seen better. Kinda seems like they’re a big deal because people make them a big deal.

I think of places like say, Germany, where casual nudity etc… doesn’t seem to be that much of a biggie. Not that I wasn’t a bit shocked (and thrilled) when, in high school, a german exchange student decided to change her clothes in front of me. In her mind, no biggie, we were friends, and friends/family change in front of each other. In my american teen mind OMG BOOBZ! I like to think I’ve grown up a bit since then.

In this girl’s case, leggings may be banned because they’re often skin tight. That being said, has anyone ever seen a school sanctioned high school girl’s volleyball uniform that wasn’t? Some consistency would be nice.

[Diarmaid]

It’s amazing that some people don’t see blatant satire, irony, or humour unless there’s a disclaimer.
Have a nice weekend.

[jsroberts]

@aikimo

Then what’s the point of a rule against wearing leggings?

Most people can agree on whether an item of clothing can be classified as leggings, but it’s much more vague when the rule is “no leggings where the crotch is overly visible”. It’s the same with skirt length - if you have a clear indication of what length is OK, it allows teachers to state what is and isn’t too revealing without being accused of being a pervert. (I mean, they may well get that anyway, but not as much as if they said “everyone can see your butt if you bend over”).

None of this really matters if you feel that what a student wears is irrelevant, but this seems like the most practical way to go if the school wants to make a dress code based on some standard of decency.

[calocke]

@Ignatius

Then why not make the rule about that?

How is it not about that? Let me guess… You don’t work in a school.

Leggings by themselves reveal too much anatomy to be appropriate in the classroom. And it’s unwise to go on a case-by-case basis. So it’s a general rule. No leggings because it’s not appropriate. If you haven’t spent any time around girls in leggings, then I understand how you might not realize that it’s too much crotch for the classroom.

@Ignatius

breaking an arbitrary rule nor writing a snarky response when called on it

Sorry. It’s not an arbitrary rule. You are incorrect.

[calocke]

@aikimo

Then what’s the point of a rule against wearing leggings?

Seriously? Leggings aren’t pants. They don’t hide much. Notice there’s no indication she had anything on over them. This is the equivalent to wearing pantyhose with no skirt. It’s crackfest.

@aikimo

How do you know she was being a “dick?” Just because she broke the rules? Does ignoring stupid rules automatically make one a “dick?”

You maybe didn’t fully comprehend my previous statement. There’s always more to the story than what a 15-year-old tells you. Furthermore, look at how she filled out the form. She’s obviously got an attitude problem.

[WearySky]

@calocke

Seriously? Leggings aren’t pants. They don’t hide much. Notice there’s no indication she had anything on over them. This is the equivalent to wearing pantyhose with no skirt. It’s crackfest.

There’s no indication of ANYTHING. What I love about this thread is that we have basically no information at all, aside from the girl’s silly non-apology on the form, but that’s not stopping people from making wild accusations on both sides. She may have been wearing leggings with a long shirt so that her butt/crotch were completely covered, and Mrs Rodgers may have been a complete asshole enforcing the “no leggings” rule even though the girl was not remotely inappropriately dressed. Or she may have been wearing them with a tube top. WE DON’T KNOW. So all this arguing back and forth? Completely, ridiculously useless because we have no idea about anything to do with this situation, or even the particulars of the dress code at that schoool.

It’s fun to watch, though.

[anon68952647]

@Diarmaid

Why is this awesome?

Because she did the opposite of what you did just there. She challenged apparently arbitrary authority, with panache.

[anon68952647]

@calocke

This is the equivalent to wearing pantyhose with no skirt.

@calocke

Furthermore, look at how she filled out the form. She’s obviously got an attitude problem.

Yeah, just LOOK at this person you’ve never seen, and IMAGINE her 15 year old butt crack and attitude problems… Jeebus, you’re being a little creepy.

[Heather]

@calocke

Furthermore, look at how she filled out the form. She’s obviously got an attitude problem.

I am a teacher and a have been a school counselor as well. And of course she has an attitude problem, I don’t blame her. This is a ridiculous punishment to give a 15/16 year old. What do they expect to achieve here? This type of form filling out and shaming is about as effective as having a third grader write ten times “I will not wear leggings in class.”
They are treating her like a child. That pissed her off, as well it should. We want our junior high and high school students to act like adults but then we treat them like anything but.
As a counselor, when I worked with students, teachers were always a bit surprised that I was able to get them to calm down and listen to me. I was asked by one teacher how I managed it, my answer was simple “I listen to them.”
This punishment and these dress codes are asinine and are only set up to create a power struggle with the students. Don’t have a power struggle with a 15/16 year old.

[Ignatius]

@calocke

How is it not about that? Let me guess… You don’t work in a school.

Leggings by themselves reveal too much anatomy to be appropriate in the classroom. And it’s unwise to go on a case-by-case basis. So it’s a general rule. No leggings because it’s not appropriate. If you haven’t spent any time around girls in leggings, then I understand how you might not realize that it’s too much crotch for the classroom.

To be indelicate, you can have the wardrobe problem you’re talking about with any kind of pants that aren’t made of thick or stretchable material. Singling out leggings does not do that but it does target students who enjoy leggings and aren’t wearing them two sizes too small. In other words, it’s an arbitrary rule.

[aikimo]

If you weren’t serious, I apologize. And if you weren’t serious, then your “satire, irony, or humour” wasn’t really “blatant.” In order to ensure that people do recognize “satire, irony, or humour” as “blatant,” it’s important that there is a generous helping of wit in the mix.

[anon67050589]

@Bobo

has anyone ever seen a school sanctioned high school girl’s volleyball uniform that wasn’t?

OMG, quoted for truth. Girls volleyball as a team sport starts in 7th grade in our schools, and even the youngest girls complain that there are men in the stands whom they don’t recognize as being any of their fathers or other family members. It’s quite creepy.