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i have a feeling it’s a privilege thing. a case where the hardship and discomfort they’ve experienced becomes equated with the coercion and outright violence someone else has experienced.
some people still can’t handle the idea that for all those hard times they’ve had and overcome, a whole class of people have had it worse: their lives and physical safety were routinely threatened.
acknowledging privilege undermines some people’s sense of their own life story.
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I agree.
Gilliam has done nothing (that we know of) in the realm of sexual assault or harassment. He has merely taken a very dim view of humanity, and expressed an apparently unexamined sexist trope. Being a Harvey apologist is a terrible thing, but it can be forgiven. Make a fuss about this. Give Gilliam the shit he deserves for saying this, but don’t exile him from the realm of artists-who-we-can-still-appreciate. Tidelands, Brazil, Munchsausen, Time Bandits, Python paper craft animations are all deeply beautiful and formative in my intellectual development. I won’t let got of that art because Gilliam said something awful.
Simply put it’s extortion, dude gets his jollies for what, a few minutes, while the other women continue on with the weight of what they just did throughout their lives and the ones that don’t make it big only end up feeling like shit, can’t believe this guy doesn’t see that
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We already knew what he was like. He stood up for Polanski.
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Well a Gilliam 13 years younger said his inner child was a 12 year old girl.
Gilliam has been a large part of some of my favorite works of fiction. That has literally nothing to do with his opinion on the MeToo movement or Weinstein. Mind you, he has been complaining about “do nothing” youths for decades so this particular opinion of his is about par with the rest.
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Every time you type something new on this thread, you’re doubling down on displaying your ignorance of the MeToo movement. Maybe take 5 minutes and do some research on it?
Basically, what you describe as something the MeToo movement isn’t, or doesn’t, is actually what it is or does.
From your paragraphs above: “one monster might get caught…circumstances.” By encouraging victims to speak up, MeToo proliferates the reporting of sexual abuse and harassment, publicly, in such a way that the perpetrators face rapid discipline. What has often failed to achieve this result in the past is reporting it through channels and through the courts. It’s way too easy for the powerful to game the system with influence and wealth. MeToo changes the balance by leveraging the power of numbers against the interests of wealthy and powerful individuals.
Also: “Real action would be to change the system…punishing it afterword.” I’m sure you’ve heard the bleats of the apologists that now they are afraid of things like “dating” or “hitting on” women? That is prevention in action, my friend. All those assholes who think that dating or flirting can be conflated with sexual abuse or harassment are the ones who were either practicing or fantasizing about Weinstein-ian abuse. Guaranteed. They now at least think twice before abusing or harassing, and that is real-world prevention thanks to the MeToo movement.
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It’s not even “privilege” as much as it is “being from a different generation.” It is insane and stupid for newer generations to expect older generations to just magically flip a mental switch into accepting whatever the new paradigm is. Baby Boomers were equally as judgemental about their parents and the conformist, cookie cutter “Go Team America” suburban sprawl life that they wanted. #METOO is just the anti-war, 2nd-wave-feminist and civil-rights movements version 2.0. Or 100.0 really, since change is an eternal process every generation must face. I don’t blame Gilliam for being a little tone-deaf to the plight that younger people are fighting for- I don’t think he or anyone of his age would argue that “raping a woman” is okay, but obviously, since he’s lived an entire lifetime where Hollywood’s rules were accepted by everyone and you just dealt with it as a part of life, this new generation’s point of view is not going to click with him… or most people his age. He’s just the one brave / foolish enough to open his mouth, because he’s old and he doesn’t give a shit.
And the point he’s making about mob rule is a tried-and-true human nature law; it’s one thing to attack systemic problems, and it’s another to publicly shame and attack any person who voices an opinion that doesn’t fit the myopic dominant narrative. I’d love to fast forward 40 years and see how many of our current indignant folks find themselves where Gilliam is now, defending a point of view that has always seemed acceptable to them and all of a sudden waking up one day to find out the world no longer agrees.
Do you feel the same way about people who asked the “older generation” to accept the fundamental human rights of non-white people back in the 60s?
“Women shouldn’t be coerced into granting sexual favors for the sake of their careers” doesn’t seem like all that radical a position to me, even for someone in their 70s.
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I don’t think you’re understanding what either Mr. Gilliam nor I are saying. He is not disagreeing at all with “Women shouldn’t be coerced into granting sexual favors for the sake of their careers.” See my previous post where I went through what he actually said, line by line. Nowhere does he excuse that sort of behavior by Weinstein, whom he calls a monster. Is he a bit dismissive of the severity of the crimes men in power have been perpetuating for centuries? Yes, for the reason I just gave- it’s ridiculous to expect a human brain set in a pattern to just magically switch gears just because the culture has decided. These things take time, and generations have to die out for any true progress to be made.
Do I feel the same way about the previous generation? Well, yes, I just said that. The Baby Boomers were equally as intolerant of their parents. You’re confusing “fighting for a cause” with “judging people harshly.” We need to stand up for what’s right, but “standing up for what’s right” does not include being an intolerant, judgemental jerk who doesn’t understand how the brain works. This is a perpetual cycle of humanity, and, again, the millennials will get their dose in a few decades, too.
Feminists have been calling attention to this problem for most of Gilliam’s adult life. Women have been publicly sharing explicit stories about Weinstein in particular for many months. If Gilliam doesn’t get it by now it’s not because he hasn’t had enough time to adapt; it’s because he doesn’t want to.
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this reminds me of my high school. until the year before i was a freshman there was always a “freshman day” during homecoming week on which freshman had to wear a hat made of a paper sack and juniors and seniors who had bought a senior ring could turn the “gem” side down and pop them on the head with it. it was basically a day to haze freshmen with the blessings of the administration. that year a kid had to have stitches because he got hit once too many too hard. his parents threatened to sue the school so they no longer did freshman day during homecoming and the kid who was injured? he was shunned by most of the kids in the school because he took away the shared misery and the shared payback.
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Even if that was true (it’s not, social progress has sped up incredibly due to how easily it is to communicate outside your usual circle), Gilliam being an old man who shouldn’t be yapping his trap about things he doesn’t understand doesn’t provide a better context to what he said and is just a poor excuse for him complaining about a non-existent mob of have-your-cake-and-eat-it-too women.
Weinstein, Cosby, Franken, O’Reily, et al being removed from power outside the court of law is a good thing; Gilliam is demanding an impossible standard for society to meet to show that someone seated in power must go - especially if he himself doesn’t like that Hollywood has always been that way.
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Oh, Terry. I haz a disappoint.
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A lot of old people feel like they have earned the right to be how they are or just ran out of fucks to give. My ex-MiL straight up basically said this to me at one point. “Too old to change.” “…old dog new tricks.” etc Probably one reason they make such shitty people as politicians. 
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sure it’s privilege – and of a horrific sort – to grow up in a time when the only people expected to be in charge were people who happened to have been born with the same sex, skin color, sexual orientation, and religious background as you. gilliam had a hard time b/c show biz is hard – but at least he didn’t have to fight every day to prove that his native traits didn’t disqualify his participation.
moreover are we really destined to fossilize at the age of… what? 28? 36? 51? – when are we so old that we should just throw in the towel?
it’s just an excuse. an other way of telling people wait a generation and things will get better. but, things don’t change by waiting. they change because enough is enough already.
side note, please see the several other posts above why that mob rule phrase is offensive.
but here’s a thought, if a person can’t stand others criticizing their viewpoint, maybe they shouldn’t offer that viewpoint to the world. i’m pretty sure everybody has said the wrong thing for the wrong reason at one time or another – you listen to people, learn from them, and do better the next time. at any age.
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holy f. is all i can say.
sunk cost fallacies. same things apply to medical school and fraternities. people are weird sometimes.
sigh
even the thought of it makes me angry. i feel like i probably would have broken a few windows or something if teachers had let someone smash me in head for no good reason.
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BTW, for a counter example on “being old gives you a free pass on being a douche”, see Harry Smith.
https://twitter.com/harryslaststand/status/916718572793221120
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