Bioplastics aren’t an exotic material, they might even be more common than we realize though i presume regular plastic is just easier and cheaper to make because that’s what everything is already set up for and there’s a lot of oil to go around. Right now there’s not a lot of incentive (business-wise) to switch to more bioplastics unfortunately, i’m not sure what would need to happen for that flip to occur. Maybe oil extraction and refining would need to become much more expensive, or have legislation forcing for a percentage of certain plastics made to not come from oil.
2 Likes
This is my Emerald X20 guitar. It is technically plastic, although usually referred to by the name of its reinforcing material, carbon fiber. It’s a fine instrument, and not inexpensive. But it plays and sounds superb, and allows me to save my vintage Martin for home and studio use, and take the Emerald out into the scary world, where it laughs at bumps and vibration and extremes of temperature and humidity.
8330004490_3a6f8ec2a4_c copy.jpg
10 Likes
Some of us were hip to plastic instruments way back when. I remember the forced smile on my mom’s face as she endured hearing a stage full of grade school kids belt out “Three Blind Mice.”
8 Likes
I understand that. I do think if society as a whole switches, the cost will go down (which is probably a reason they’re not widespread now, as traditional plastics are cheaper now, and money drives all). I do think if it’s a bioplastic from a plant that needs to be cultivated and grown, there are other issues that need to be considered, such as the type of land it’s grown on, what other uses the plant has that it will be competing with (such as with corn), etc.
We need to take the shit out of it, in addition to taxing consumers at the pump (although, that has other problems, such as being a heavier tax on the working poor).
You’d think that 1.5 billion animals dying in australia would be motivating, but you said it there. At some point we have to start making decisions for the good of the planet, though. Just making incremental changes via taxation and the like aren’t going to do it.
3 Likes
I’ve been on the market for a pBone for a little while. In my case, I play a lot of street band music. I’m not interested in bringing my good horns out around bad weather, drunken audiences, police at protests, etc. I’ve seen a bunch of plastic instruments at various gigs, and the hold up pretty well. There might be a bit of a higher breakage rate, but musicians are being less careful. (Which is my intent, too.)
There really is no technical reason that good instruments can’t be made from plastic. If you’re going to go through the trouble of precise engineering, and (in many cases) hand finishing, then materials aren’t really the bulk of the cost for an instrument. The important part is caring enough to make a good instrument. For a hundred quid on eBay, some manufacturers care more than others.
3 Likes
A bioplastic could be not biodegradable and a petroleum based plastic could be biodegradable, it all depends about the process and the final polymer result.
Cellophane (and rayon) looks like plastic but it’s actually biodegradable, and in some conditions will degrade faster than cotton.
The idea about biofuels is to use the with waste products or plants growing in places were other useful plants can’t be put. Like in the old days people were putting trees to cut and use in the stove.
1 Like
The last possible thing in the world we need is more plastic crap to dump into the environment. We have a centuries long tradition of making musical instruments out of (mostly) natural materials like wood and metal. Let’s just do that. Think of the children!
1 Like
or torture them!
I would literally jump out of this plane, after punching him in the face. i really don’t like him.
6 Likes
Which is why we should not be thinking in terms of what’s best for industry bottom lines, but for the environment. At no point did I say that bioplastics were a silver bullet solution. In fact, i did not even propose bioplastics as a solution, someone else did…
Industry will do what is most cost effective, not what is the best for the environment. They have shown us that over and over. And when GWB signed a fuel standards mandate into law that include provisions about biofuel, they included from corn and sugar, and corn ethanol is the most widely used…
So again, we have options, but industry will go with the most “cost effective” in the short term. If it’s cheapest to use non-biodegradable, hard to recycle petrolum based plastics, they will. Because they care about short term profits, not burning kangaroos.
1 Like
A friend of mine dumped a guy, with his love of “smooth jazz” being the clincher.
5 Likes
Maybe that’s what I remember.
Or maybe those famous artists all used plastic instruments at some point, making them “common” but we know because someone decided to take note. The implication does seem that the artists were making do,but they were exceptional artists so maybe they saw value or a specific sound.
That’s a legit reason to dump someone.
6 Likes
As others have said, it’s not plastic that causes bad, it’s cheap.
That works two ways, they may be lousy instruments, but because they are cheap people throw them away. That is much less likely with an instrument made with traditional materials, they are too expensive. So maybe people need to look at their buying habits, and discard habits.
1 Like
I don’t hate him only because of his music. I worked with him when i worked in the music industry and well…let’s just say I don’t like him.
3 Likes
Good times. I prefer metal, because playing a flute wearing fingerless gloves in freezing cold temperatures builds character. 
All this reminds me of the silver vs. nickel controversy. I played two vintage silver instruments (flute and sax), and the weight difference was significant. Ultimately, it’s why I stopped marching with the sax.
2 Likes
I understand that harpsichords have delrin plectra. That’s one of my favorite two-word phrases. Delrin plectra.
Plastic instruments have been around almost as long as I have. The Maccaferri ukes and guitars from the 1950s were serviceable versions of their wood counterparts, but I would not choose one over a traditional instrument if I were playing out. I have a couple of old Maccaferri guitars–they’re suprisingly pleasant-sounding. On the other hand, they’re styrene, which is much harder to repair than a wood guitar (my 120-year-old Washburns are as scarred and fixed up as old rodeo clowns), and my conventional guitars sound better. I realize that “sounds as good as or better than” is a subjective matter, but I have to wonder about Mark F’s take on a Fluke vs, say, a classic Martin. I’ve heard both, and while the Flukes are certainly adequate, I prefer the voice of a Martin or Gibson or Kamaka. The greatest virtues of plastic ukes are price and toughness. (Plastic guitars–or to be accurate for current tech, carbon fiber–are more expensive than their wood counterparts and, to these ears, adequate but suboptimal.)
Yes. In fact it’s the famous Massey Hall concert with Mingus, Bud Powell and Max Roach. Apparently the guy that was marketing that same plastic sax Ornette poses with on “Shape of Jazz to Come” happened to be at the show and saw a marketing opportunity, offered it to Bird for the gig.
Not many of those saxes survive because the stuff was brittle like Bakelite, which ironically makes them pricey collectibles now.
ETA:
The luthier that made the “gypsy” guitars that Django Reinhardt used, Mario Maccaferri, later went on to market his own plastic guitars. He apparently also made some plastic ukes for Arthur Godfrey.
I’m kind of annoyed to see even his plastic guitars are now sought after, because I remember when Lark In The Morning bought the last remaining copies and sold them for cheap through their catalog in the mid-90’s.
1 Like
I tried one of these last month as Junior has played the trumpet for 3 years and is about ready to start pep/marching band. I thought it was fun, and would be great for marching if you have the mouth for it, but he couldn’t get decent notes out of it and the valves were a bit loud and stiff. I don’t think this is a great beginner horn, and even for $120 there might be better starter brass options that are either rented or bought used. But I want one even though I don’t have a good reason. Maybe as an excuse to start a Ska Band?
Yes, weight is another interesting choice for materials. I went with a plated alto flute because it is a lighter instrument that I can play for longer. These plastic instruments can be quite lightweight …good for marching, children, people with different physical abilities, etc.
1 Like
