The new Apple campus has a 100,000 sqft gym and no daycare

I don’t think you did. But that’s most likely what would happen. We’re still a very patriarchal culture in a lot ways. [quote=“Max_Blancke, post:82, topic:101116”]
I just wish that more jobs paid well enough that one spouse at least had the option to stay home with the kids.
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But to be fair, this was sort of unique to the 1950s. Prior to that (the depression era) many women worked, because they had to. And historically, the entire family unit, not just the father, was engaged in labor outside the home in some way. And it was incredibly rare for black women to have the opportunity to stay home, most especially, right up to the modern era. In some cases, the bias against black men working was so strong, especially in the south, that black women were the primary breadwinners.

It’s not that I don’t “approve” of it… that’s entirely irrelevant. I just refuse to give up my rights as a citizen so people can realize some white washed ideal that barely existed in history. The question isn’t how others organize their lives, because I have no interest in telling others what to do and how to live. I do have an objection to an entire social structure predicated on the diminishment of my contributions to society, which is just how that would play out. The war on women continues, even if you can’t see it. We know it’s there and we feel that the gains we’ve made are incredibly precarious here.

You’d be surprised, actually. Some people do have children and regret what they had to give up to raise them, because they were pressured into it, because they weren’t equipped to deal with the pressures of parenthood, because their children were not what they were told to expect. This is more true of women, even today, who are still told that the ultimate fulfillment of their lives is child rearing and serving others. Wanting something outside of that is still considered selfish on the part of women.

I’d much rather live in a world where those choices aren’t foisted upon people. I think the ideal should be that every child is a wanted child, that all families, however they are structured get the support they need to make the right choices for their family, and that people who have no interest in having a family aren’t marginalized by the political and economic structures we build as a society. We have the means to make a world where people can decide that one person can stay home and raise a child, and not be devalued or belittled for it. We just don’t have the political will to do so. As long as the ingrained bias against women doing anything that’s considered “man’s work”, it’s going to fall on women.

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Those are perfectly valid observations. However, I am not sure that you can convince me that most grandparents are unsafe to be left with the kids, or that the traditional family primarily serves to allow the husband to be abusive.
I also never said anything about “when women went straight from their family home to a marriage with little or no higher education and little or no work experience”.
My wife and I both come from families where our Moms attended college, and worked satisfying jobs after graduation. They married, then later decided to have children, which they stayed home to raise. There was no abuse involved. My wife and I had our first child only when we knew that we were in a position to make that child our first priority. Grandparents and networks of friends helped immensely. And still do.

I’m pretty sure she didn’t argue that most grandparents are unsafe to be left with the kids or that the traditional family primarily serves to allow the husband to be abusive, so a bit of a strawman.

On the other hand, there’s a lot of venues where single mothers are still routinely vilified, so the sort of pressure that can prevent women from leaving abusive marriages is still in effect today to some degree. The wage gap is another example of the same thing.

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You are right, she did say the those were the conditions for one particular family. And obviously, my experiences do not invalidate hers. My original post in this thread was just that it would be nice if companies paid enough that the option of one parent staying home to raise the kids would be available, should they decide that is best for their family.
Honestly, day care at the workplace seems like a great idea, when it is feasible option. Has anyone gotten a statement from Apple about why they chose to not include daycare? It does not seem like something that would be an accidental oversight.

A bunch of comfy seats, each in front of an iPad…

Paradise!!!

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The Apple-preferred term is ‘unibody enclosure’.

I’ve fixed this for you, not because I disagree with what you’ve said, but because it is not gender-specific. All parents need to be able to take care of their children.

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My perspective came from my experience as the child of a single mother, and that definitely heavily colored my response. I like your edits – I definitely agree that while this is to some degree a gender-specific problem*, it absolutely should not be.

*The gender wage gap results in part from the fact that pregnancy is more likely to disrupt the careers of women than men for the simple reason that men are physically incapable of becoming pregnant.

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The US is so far behind when in comes to maternity/parental leave that it exacerbates that gender gap, too. I live in Germany now, and parents here can share up to 14 months of paid leave (and more unpaid) and can return to their jobs afterwards. I know a number of Americans who have decided to stay in Germany to have their children because they couldn’t afford them if they moved back to the US…

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Yes. I’m surprised they didn’t attach a school and college to Apple’s campus as well. They had enough room. But I guess they don’t really want to know about parents, and the only women they want are young and available.

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These problems are typical though. I live in the Seattle area and I have basically no options if I want to stay close to work and get a larger home. It’s the price of being located somewhere desirable.

It’s like he doesn’t get who we are at all.

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