Today's "lone wolf" killers are actually a pack

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Incels just don’t ‘get it’ that their misogyny and white supremacist views are what make women not want to be around them. And then they just turn to the incel online groups who reinforce their twisted world view.

I have a friend who went on a first date with one of these jerks. he kept telling her she was used goods because she was 31 years old. He kept talking about how women over the age of 20 should be available at discounted rates. He kept mentioning that he had to be smarter than her. (she’s pretty smart, works as a coder, got perfect SAT scores) He actually said something he believed about how too much sex stretches out a woman’s privates so the roast beef curtains grow so large as to be unattractive to him and the um, va-jay-jay becomes so weak it iss useless. He kept hammering on about how a woman somehow ages sexually much faster than men. (despite lots of people doing it in nursing homes)

As a gift, he tried to give her a bunch of burned CDs with libertarian lectures on then them, so that she could become educated. She gave them back towards the end of the evening when he started talking about his plans for after they were married. She would be turning her entire paycheck over to him to manage. He apparently lived in a small room in the B&B her worked in, which he got for free. He expected her to give up almost all her worldly possessions and share the room -and pay him $1100 a month for the privilege. On the way out of the restaurant, he actually yelled at her, full on in her face yelling, because she was paying a pool guy to work on her pool and he thought she should do the work herself. Needless to say, she refused his ride to her house, grabbed a taxi and got away quickly. I’m sure the guy blames her for his lack of action that night.

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shrug I didn’t post it. If you want an explanation of relevance, ask the original poster.

The way in which you are reacting makes it obvious that it’s quite important to you.

I’m pointing out that, for me, this level of vehemence is confusing. And I’m guessing that I’m not alone.

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Thank you for posting this.

A few weeks ago, I had what I thought was the mother of all bad first dates; the guy was an hour late, he talked down to me the whole time and wouldn’t even answer basic, ‘getting-to-know-you questions’.

And at the end of the disaster, to top it all off, his credit card was declined; so I ended up paying… before quickly hopping on the next subway, far the fuck away from that guy… but by comparison to your story, my night was a freakin’ cakewalk.

Your friend has my sincere sympathy.

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I can certainly see that. Also, I’m sorry to burst your infobubble. For what it’s worth, I only have what my daughters said to go on; no actual first hand interaction with the bronie community.

I enjoyed the show myself, when they would watch it, but never enough to take to the internets.

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Not sure if “Woah, that’s dark” or “Nailed it.”

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Jesus whapped.

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My mind is boggled by the thought of that person, somewhere out there. And that there are many others just like him. Ugh. “used goods”? “discounted rate”?! “roast beef curtains”?!! BOGGLED!

I’m not a violent person, but right now I would love to punch that guy in the face.

ETA not out of a sense of chivalry, or because she’s incapable of punching him herself if she had wanted. But because his is a mouth that could use a bit of punching.

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There are some MRA / incel / whatever types where I’m pretty sure they would actually turn down the opportunity to have all those things they claim to want, because what’s really driving them is the anger and hate. I would guess your friend ran into one of those guys, who aggressively self-sabotaged the whole thing so he could soak in his “justified” anger at the women.

(Thank goodness we don’t live in a galaxy far, far away, because these guys would jump at the chance to become a Sith, or even just the henchman for some Sith asshole.)

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I don’t understand the brony-hate. I generally try not to judge people too hard for their fandoms. As far as I am aware, the authors of My Little Pony aren’t racist KKK Nazi’s and “incels”. While the “incel” term is brand new to my lexicon, I find it weird that out of the blue there’s a reason to lump an unrelated group of people - bronies - with the “incel” group.

I’m guessing it has something to do with the idea that you accept “incel” as a category of people and not a specific group of people, which bothers me. It’d be much like say that Germans, categorically by being German, are NAZI’s. So I’m kind of bothered in a sense, that a new word was added to my lexicon because of a murderer, and now that word is being used to hate on non-deserving ostracized groups.

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I’m in the same club. The first I heard of it was yesterday on news site. Apparently the term has been kicking around for awhile though; so I figured I was just ill-informed.

I’m sorry. When did I do that? Also how is that? I see them as a specific category of people clumping in a group; the specificity being misogynists, with a helping spoonful of racism and nationalism around the edges.

I do not see how that is the same as equating “all Germans are Nazis”, any more than “all Nazis are German”.

All incels =/= bronies, and all bronies =/= incels. Does that mean that no bronies are incels, and no incels are bronies?

Even if you pare down a group to two people, there’s a good chance that at least 50% of them are going to be assholes. The more people you add – depending on the purpose of the group – the more the percentages will shift one way or the other.

Will it ever be 100% of one thing and 0% of another the larger the group gets? Even if you pare it down to a single person, you won’t get to an absolute. That guy… he’s a bit of an asshole, but he’s nice to dogs.

I also don’t think anybody discussing bronies in this thread said they are all incels.

If I have time I may have to go back and check what I wrote before addressing you the first time, but I’m pretty sure my first mention of bronies was in bringing your attention to the post that brought bronies into this thread to begin with.

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How do you define an incel in this context?

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*sighs

Every fandom in existence has at least a small portion of its members who are assholes, (or something even worse) because people are not monolithic.

Just because someone really likes the same books/tv shows/movies/whatever that you do, that does not automatically guarantee that they share the same core values that you have.

As for “incels:”

They are men who feel that they are ‘involuntarily celibate’ due to someone else’s doing; be it the government, current society for “favoring” women over men, (yeah right, bro) or women themselves, for daring to have any agency over their own minds and bodies.

Again, they have often been conditioned to see women as mere objects, commodities, and trophies which are “owed” to them, rather than actual human beings. When that perception is proven to be false, the negative feelings they harbor often escalate into bitter resentment and hatred, which can be lethally weaponized by other misogynists goading them on.

And from there, the path to violence against women is an easy one for some males to follow:

"Every day, women are subjected to violence for similar reasons to those that incels offer but without similar media attention. Women who deny men sex are raped and killed without the involvement of any oddball internet forums. Women are also subjected to murder and abuse when men decide that they are too sexually available to other men. Women are killed because some man or another, who may not be known to them, decides that they will be held to account for his own inability to make lasting social connections, or to live the life to which he feels he is entitled.'

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I would define them as people who identify themselves as being members of the incel group/movement/plague.

So what I’m saying is that a bronie can be an incel as well, and vice-versa, if that’s how he chooses to identify himself. Not that all bronies are incels, or vice-versa.

I’m really starting to wonder if I made a typo somewhere that has drawn your ire.

This. In fact, everything Melz2 said.

As for you, at this point I’m regretting engaging you in conversation over this topic, and am now going to back away and let you continue to be you, while I continue to be me, with nobody changed or improved.

Have a fine weekend.

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There is an educational blog called wehuntedthemammoth.com that tracks online misogyny.

Don’t binge it without sedating yourself somehow first — your head may explode.

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I heard about that blog for the first time yesterday as well. I… I can’t bring myself to go there.

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I don’t think this is the land of brony-haters. I don’t know much about My Little Pony but it seems to me the simplest explanation for the widespread fandom across age and gender lines is the show must be pretty good.

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I’m still trying to figure out where that erroneous impression even came from, outside of that badly designed not-actually-a-Venn diagram someone posted upthread.

(It really is, actually.)

But this post isn’t about fandoms or casting aspersions on them; it’s about the radicalization of misogyny, in just one of its many forms…

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So much this, thank you for posting that. I want to add on to it with an excerpt from another article:

"Until the Toronto attack, “Incels” were treated as a sad boy joke that only the crazy feminists were concerned about, because not until Jack the Ripper is actually out slitting women open do people even get concerned about what happens when women try to navigate freely in the world. It should shock me that, in such a short period of time people, have decided to focus on trying to have empathy for this self-imposed problem.

As a black woman, which I’m gonna assume is in that “minority groups treated as unattractive by the majority” pile, I can say, do I get upset about beauty standards that put me below a basic Susan? 100%. Do I feel like I am entitled to any man or woman because of it? No. I stunt. I learned, and am constantly learning, to be confident in my own skin, be happy with my body, and know that if someone doesn’t want to be with because I’m black … fuck ’em.

I can’t speak for any other marginalized group, but what I will assume is that none of them want sex because of entitlement. They just don’t want to be defined by what makes them an “other.” They don’t want to be abused, taken advantaged of, or in the case of trans women, murdered.

Let’s not bring marginalized issues into what is, overwhelmingly, a white, cis, straight man-pain “movement.”

Their ideology is nebulous, but it centers around the misogynist idea that women are sub-human villains who will bestow sex on only the most attractive and/or rich of men, and that it’s unfair because men don’t treat women this way—despite their entire grievance being centered around not getting sex from women they find attractive. They have nothing to offer or to give, but they want so much from women because they have convinced themselves that they are worth that.

Giving them robot women, rewarding them for their narcissism and violence is not the answer, because I can almost promise you that they will not accept that solution. They want to control, not to love.

madmax

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Holy fucksocks; that must have been posted by my ‘sister from another mister,’ because it sounds so similar to something I’d write myself.

Again fuckin’ A; that’s the real issue at hand - these No-Sells are not mad at injustice or an unequal system, they’re mad that they are not the ones “sitting on the top of the heap,” running shit.

Unfuck all that entitled noise.

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If you read their subreddit braincels, or their various independent online forums, there are lots of disturbing beliefs being reinforced. Like: women should be forced to marry in their early teens, before age 16, to older men so they grow up learning to serve that man properly. That colleges should severely restrict admission to women, that the US military space programs fell apart once they started hiring women and people of color. That school sex ed programs teach too much because they teach women that it’s possible for them to pleasure themselves. That LGBQT people should just be celibate and invisible in society. I could go on, but this stuff is frightening. Remember, these men walk among us every day.

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