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Which I do not. I follow her here, and on other places, and mostly I agree with her. And I know that she has the misfortune (?) of being a leftist who lives in a US state that typical runs right, though it’s getting better. But complaining that the French nearly voted in a nationalist candidate, when your own country nearly did so as well, is disingenuous. Hence my pot, kettle comment.
I was going to sarcastically ask had you seen France recently (or Sweden, or Italy etc.) but you’re already there.
It may well be that more diverse parties allows people to express their batshit loony views better and allows far right parties to gradually get a foot on the ladder. But the US primary system seems to have that effect too so who knows?
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Then you might rethink two aspects of your assertions in this thread:
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Sinema didn’t join a 3rd party. She left a party and is on her own. There is no such thing as the “Independent Party.” There are just unaffiliated politicians. The (now) other two independents in the Senate, Sanders and King, both caucus with the Democrats, but have very different policy stances individually. In the House, there are independents who are conservative and ones who are progressive. They don’t even talk to each other.
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If it helps, think of the Republicans as 2 parties in a coalition (Fascists and Conservatives) and the Democrats as ~5 parties in a coalition (ranging from Conservative-Lite to Democratic Socialists). The only real difference from a typical European Parliamentary system is that in the US, those coalitions form prior to elections, rather than after in an attempt to form a majority government.
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Not a single one of us claimed that our system was perfect… those of us who pay attention to politics are certainly well aware of the limitations of it. We’re doing our best to improve shit, but apparently, that’s not good enough… 
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Independent candidate ≠ third party candidate.
She’s not moving to establish a third party or join an existing one. Nor is she trying to change the system in such a way that would make third party candidates viable contenders in national (or even statewide) elections.
She is in this for herself, and no one other than herself.
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GA is not as red as I think you think
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That’s how this whole subthread started yes… You condescended about how fucked up the American political system is (which, YEAH, WE KNOW) from a country that just nearly voted in a fascist, too.
My point isn’t that any one has a perfect system, free of problems - it’s that EVERYONE lives in imperfect systems, and acting like one is somehow morally superior just because you happen to live in a different fucked up system isn’t particularly helpful! Unlike you, I NEVER argued that the US system is free of problems, which is pretty much what you did from your first condescending post here.
Lots of African immigrants from former French colonies… funny that…
Yeah, it’s just as much bullshit there as it is here… Those people often are buying into racist framing of immigration that is a byproduct of western imperialism.
Thanks! I clicked around for like 2 seconds and didn’t find anything, so thanks for the link.
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But somehow the opposite is NOT true? Face it… France has some real issues right now. If over 40% is voting for Le Penn’s party, then you have a real problem. I don’t look down on France or any other country and the people there for those problems, because the reality is that there is only so much we can do to radically change systems - it takes time and effort. But I sure as shit don’t mock people who are dealing with far right political parties in their countries. Most of us in the west are dealing with the far right challenging our democratic systems. This is not an American thing, so LAUGHING AT others dealing with the same problem isn’t helpful. It’s fucking hurtful, in fact. It’s pretty clear that some just don’t give a shit who gets hurt, as long as they can feel superior to us benighted Americans who are all dumbasses who get what they deserve, apparently.
yeah, the French electorate backing her in such high numbers is incredibly distributing. I don’t find it the least bit amusing, as others seem to find our current woes here in the US. I understand that these things are highly interconnected, that has global repercussions (not the least of which is pulling Macron to the right, and ensuring a continued hellscape for refugees feeling climate change and other after-effects of colonialism.
it could be… but much like the approach to hate speech (with the US historically taking the view that it should be allowed, and places like Germany taking a hardline against it), both seem to have real limitations. Both the US and places in Europe are having problems with the far right, despite differing approaches to these issues…
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Your second point is a really great “nutshell” of our system. I hadn’t thought of it that way before, so thank you!
Exactly. It’s hurtful and condescending, and then to get all defensive when people respond by calling out your own system’s flaws is like picking on some poor kid for their crappy sneakers then getting all offended when they point out your halitosis in turn.
One can criticize the system without condescending to those of us who are fighting for our lives over here.
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I think the path of least resistance to let smaller parties get a foot in the door is to keep the idea of electing representatives, but to get rid of districts in the states. Instead, have it such that the individuals with the most votes get in. For Wyoming nothing would change, but for a state like California it would mean the first 52 of a field of 150+ candidates.
I don’t think that would really make sense for a state like California where the issues that matter to voters really do vary dramatically depending on which part of the state people live in.
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California is the most extreme end of the scale, and for practical purposes would have to have semi-districts to keep the number of candidates on a ballot down to only 50 or so. Organized by party, so you could go straight party, or you have 12 votes, give 10 to the party, and two to guys you actually know and support.
I’m riffing off of the German system here, hang with me.
But pretty much all states have some people who live in rural areas and some people who live in urban areas so voters in different districts really do have different interests.
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Ah, yes, the old tug of war between “rural versus urban” and “people vote, not land”. What I meant with California being at the extreme end is that asking a state to vote on all 52 representatives at once would be cognitive overload. The size of the ballot would be prohibitive, as there would be at least 150 candidates.
The concept of districts was supposed to allow for the whole one representative for the rural voters, another for the urban voters, but gerrymandering made a hash of that. No district today follows that principle.
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I’m not sure that France’s move rightward is due to middle eastern immigrants more than French bigotry towards middle eastern immigrants.
But I am sure that the U.S.’s nazism is due to European immigrants.
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Um…so fix (eliminate) gerrymandering, then? You’re making the same argument for the US election system as Musk is for Twitter.
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