D.C. Fontana and George Elliot would agree with you.
4 Likes
I hear ya. Misogyny is alive and well, and I’m so very tired of it. Being a woman is just exhausting.
11 Likes
That’s the thing though; feeling the male equivalent of ‘White man’s burden’ and silencing yourself isn’t helpful to anyone. Instead use your newfound awareness as a tool to be a good ally.
Endeavoring to listen more and speak less is a viable step, but it’s not the only one.
Poe’s law, dude.
10 Likes
Having a daughter, that is kinda depressing to hear.
5 Likes
The duality of Mann.
5 Likes
In a former job, I worked for a mortgage broker. We used to laugh at the “male voice on the phone” phenomenon. When an irate customer would call, they would first talk to the woman I supervised. She would tell them “XYZ”, and they would often still be upset, and want to talk to her supervisor. I would then tell them “XYZ”, and they would usually calm down and say, “OK”. I’d like to think it was because of my charm and logic, but often I would tell them exactly the same thing my female co-worker had told them. This worked with both male and female customers, as I recall.
3 Likes
I find it quite depressing that a lot of men have to hear the exact same experience relayed to them from no less than 10 women before they’ll begin contemplating believing even one woman’s experience.
As I said - exhausting.
16 Likes
It’s even more ‘depressing’ when you experience it firsthand.
>_<
But you can counter some of the negativity by being your daughter’s advocate, which it already seems like you are, just from what you’ve posted…
14 Likes
My problem is 1) I don’t treat people like that, so it doesn’t make sense to me that others would. And 2) About half of the office I work in is women and I don’t see that sort of behavior around here. Although it could be hidden in emails etc. We are a fairly well functioning team here.
Like I said, I have a lot of communication with “Implementations” and I’d say 75% of them are women and never approached an interaction from the position of they couldn’t do something. Even the new people who actually DON’T know what they are doing (due to poor training, not their actual fault) I try to help out and get them up to speed. It helps everyone invovled once they are.
In fact if there is one person I am curt with its a guy, and he’s earned all the shit he gets.
That said, I know shit happens in other offices. My ex works for the dept of labor and there is a ton of office politics. The worst being them taking YEARS to get rid of a sexual predator, including giving the guy one year with pay leave while they sorted it out. Fucking nuts. (He never did anything to her, but his horror stories are just that.)
2 Likes
The first thing that came to mind after reading this was the catcalling experiment videos. Some of the reaction to them seemed worse than 10 women saying the same thing. I guess the denial is really deep when people won’t believe what that they can see and hear.
10 Likes
Yep, absolutely one of the reasons I am happy to be transitioning out of IT. I am a cis female with a very feminine name and an unusually masculine nickname. When I went from using my real name to my nickname, I noticed that the level of pushback and BS with outside vendors went down considerably. Mostly, I was mad at myself for not using my nickname sooner. Unfortunately though, this only works over email, and I still had to deal with being spoken over in meetings, having my ideas only accepted when I asked my male coworkers to suggest them, and generally being seen as less competent than men doing the same work as me.
11 Likes
But the rest of the world is not you. The reality that happens outside of yourself and your experiences still matters, whether it’s actually logical to you or not.
Again, complacency and apathy are two huge elements at work there, methinks.
7 Likes
Right, I am not saying I don’t believe it happens. I just don’t understand WHY people act like that. Then again I say that about a lot of things…
2 Likes
Here’s a hint; stop wasting good time & energy by trying to.
The motivation for some things are just beyond comprehension.
7 Likes
Former techie here, too. Other than formal signatures, I never used my full name - just initials or a nickname, which sounded like Jack. Oh, the shock on people’s faces when they met me for the first time was priceless!
In meetings, I would often wait until the guys had nearly talked themselves out before suggesting anything. Starting my input with, “Y’know what could save a lot of time/money/effort…” usually got their attention, though. One thing I will not miss were the annual reviews, when I was dinged for being too quiet and having lower profile projects (all on time or early, error-free, and within budget). My male colleagues got bonuses and the best project assignments despite frequent missed deadlines, cost overruns, and major problems pushed into production.
10 Likes
I think a lot of it is sort of a relexive defense. Accepting and believing other’s experiences sometimes means accepting a whole bunch of other uncomfortable things.
No one wants to be considered part of a group that mistreats others who are not part of that group, or be told that their life might be easier at the expense of others; we all want to believe that we earned our success, and that the world is just. Additionally not experiencing “isms”, which is the thing making your life easier, is imperceptible.
Unfortunately, many people choose denial over the work of acceptance, which would move us down the right path to ending “isms”.
Edit: missing words
6 Likes
I’d argue that many do, they are just loath to admit it; because such an admission inherently negates their own personal myth of being “the good guy.”
6 Likes
Fair point, and very much along the same lines of the cognitive dissonance I was trying to get at.
4 Likes
You’re doing a good job, as usual.
I know it gets tedious repeating oneself ad nauseum, in hopes that maybe this time the message will actually hit its mark and stick.
4 Likes
“Death Comes to Pemberley”?
1 Like
