UK home secretary wants to overturn human rights treaties and make terror suspects stateless

It’s remarkable, the strength of the pull away from centuries of development of a working society. It’s pure megalomania - we’ve got such an odd generation of politicians at the moment, and a buckled citizenry trying to cope with the troubles engendered by the financial crisis, such that the politicians are getting away with it.

It’s a trick used in hypnotism (I know a little bit). Generally, people, even “under hypnosis”, will only do what they want to do. The way round that, to say, get them to dance like a chicken naked, is to identify the pathway of resistance / persuasion that leads to them being willing to do it. Then layer by layer, you work on the resistance, or find the desire, and move to the next layer.

The idea of cancelling treaties and suchlike is abhorrent. Europe was in-fighting constantly until 1945 (edit: sorry), then pretty much quieted down for the rest of the century. I put that down to everyone (i) being afraid of the Soviets, and pulling together, and (ii) recognising just how horrific the world they’d previously created had become.

Theresa May is like some alien implant. Or some outlying village dweller, who’s never seen beyond the local fields. But she’s in the cabinet, and I’m sure she and Cameron have a symbiotic methodology. Given the Tories general desire to concentrate power and wealth, May is a helpful sidekick.

The whole thing is despicable.

1 Like

Good on her. They want the luxury of multiple citizenships

Hardly a luxury at all is it. I almost had dual nationality because my parents traveled. You seem to have a very, might I say simplistic view of the world. Life is not black and white as you seem to imply. How exactly does one “commit” to a country anyway? By blind flag waving of one side. Supporting the latest invasion to ‘fight terror’. Blind nationalism. By thinking that those that run that country have your best interests at heart and thereby unquestioningly sleepwalking into whichever is the edict of the day.

This is all starting to feel a lot like fascism to me.



actions are eventually punished

Gimme a break, this is a candidate for Pathological science - Wikipedia

Mm. What does it do? I had a look, but mid-work and lots to see.

Just learn to dress appropriately, and I’m sure you could cope with the Finnish winters just fine.

Basically the idea is to hide a revolution inside a box labelled ‘business as usual’: start a co-op and grow it until it encompasses an entire supply chain, demonstrating to folks how much fun and productivity can be liberated by starting from a clean sheet vis-a-vis our organising principles, and not giving the fruits of our labours to an elite to hoard for no benefit.

Given the absurd powers that large corporations now wield, it should be possible to largely secede inside one that’s designed to confer freedom and citizenship to its employees.

The Basque mob Mondragon may be well on the way to achieving this, but if they share this notion’s ultimate intent they’re keeping it under their hats.

1 Like

Aha! I’m working on a similar-ish project of my own around making it infinitely easier to run a business and compete with the big fellas, giving little businesses what they need to run perfectly smoothly and focus on what it is they do best.

Sounds corporate, however the notion is that by disrupting the money flow to and around a given set of connected individuals / companies, you maximise happiness for everybody. Gives more choice over money flows. That might be something I add - “where your money goes”

It does, though, imply hard work!

1 Like

Y’know, I slept on this whole issue last night, a bit fitfully, but came up with an idea that isn’t so at odds with what TM and her hoard of ne’er-do-wells are bullying through.

A bit of quid pro quo. See, my neighbour - now, we’re not the best of friends. But I’d be ok with the passport thing, if it meant that by grassing the neighbour up, I could say … cause him to lose his driving license, and maybe bank accounts too. Or even just internet connection.

Y’know - some kind of give and take. I’m not so hard-headed as to be stupid. There’s wiggle room everywhere.

I dont’ think he meant it…

Just to get this out of the way: It doesn’t take a trial to make a felon in the US. It only takes a defense lawyer who convinces an innocent young person that they’ll be better off pleading guilty to a lesser charge than the one they were accused of because the deck is stacked against them and their innocence may not save them and it will be much worse for them if they go to trial and the jury sides with the cops, etc, yadda yadda…

Next, being put on the no-fly list while you are out of the US when the only country you have citizenship in is the US is equivalent to having your passport revoked in the sense that it also strands you in a foreign country where you do not have the right to stay. That was @nunavutwolf’s point.

Finally, there is a difference between revoking a passport and revoking citizenship. The problem here is that they 1) already have revoked people’s citizenship when they had a second citizenship to fall back on, 2) she seems to be using “revoke their passport” as a euphemism for “revoke their citizenship” based on the context, and by looking at the ongoing argument between all the parties of the actual debate, and 3) even if it was only a case of revoking the passport of a person with no right to another passport while that person was abroad, it would have the same effect of stranding that person in a country where they don’t have the right to stay in the first place.

Being stranded in a country where you are an “illegal alien” can be scary at best, and horrific at worst. It may involve being put in a terrible prison. It may be worse, depending on which country you find yourself stranded in. And, since your passport has been revoked while you were out of the country, you probably didn’t find out until you showed up at the airport to board your plane home. That means that you don’t get the chance to run and hide. You are right there for the police to pick up and deal with however that country deals with illegal immigrants. Lovely.


You’re absolutely right, but it’s kind of beside my point. No-fly lists and the like are outrage enough in real life; there’s no need to conflate them with The Man Without a Country.

This topic was automatically closed after 5 days. New replies are no longer allowed.