“It’s not food, it’s Chow!”
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I once observed a team of Buddhist monks labor for about a week constructing an elaborate sand mandala, only to wipe it away within a minute. I didn’t even get to eat any of the sand!
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Whenever I think of fine dining and vegetarianism, I think of the late Anthony Bourdain’s many comments about vegetarians. For instance:
“Vegetarians, and their Hezbollah-like splinter-faction, the vegans, are a persistent irritant to any chef worth a damn.
To me, life without veal stock, pork fat, sausage, organ meat, demi-glace, or even stinky cheese is a life not worth living.
Vegetarians are the enemy of everything good and decent in the human spirit, an affront to all I stand for, the pure enjoyment of food. The body, these waterheads imagine, is a temple that should not be polluted by animal protein. It’s healthier, they insist, though every vegetarian waiter I’ve worked with is brought down by any rumor of a cold.
Oh, I’ll accommodate them, I’ll rummage around for something to feed them, for a ‘vegetarian plate’, if called on to do so. Fourteen dollars for a few slices of grilled eggplant and zucchini suits my food cost fine.”
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This reminds me of a dinner I had at minibar in DC a few years back. To this day, I’m not sure exactly what it was - food, science, art, a play? Perhaps all the above.
The fact that I still think about it means, I think, it was a significant experience. But, then again, food affects me in weird and deeply emotional ways. As in, I cried while watching Bourdain’s film on El Bulli; I remember travel predominantly through food; and I cook as an expression of love.
Tldr: a $335 cucumber isn’t for everyone.
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I’ve been to a couple of really, truly excellent restaurants that opened up new ideas for me as a home cook. A couple of years ago we took our family to one in Montreal that was really outstanding. But the total meal for 3 big eaters and one picky 10 year old who would only eat toast was $250, and it was a huuuge splurge for us.
I still think about some of the things they fed us though. Totally worth every penny.
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Liked for the Good Omens ref.
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Sure, and lots of music and dance is never recorded, or even witnessed.
But imagine that after those monks finished their mandala, they left the room, and then some oaf came in, glanced at it and knocked the table over. From a Buddhist perspective it’s irrelevant to the exercise, but that doesn’t necessarily mean you’d want to be the oaf in that story, especially if you believed the monks made the mandala for you.
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The same can be said for sporting events, concerts, fashion, fine art, cars, homes, vacations, collectibles, and pretty much everything else that people spend discretionary dollars on.
And it’s entirely possible to enjoy a $335 tasting menu at 11MP and still go to a hole-in-the-wall ethnic joint the next night and enjoy that, too. I’ve had vegetarian tasting menus at a few different Michelin starred restaurants, and have thoroughly enjoyed every one. They in no way diminish the enjoyment I get out of the $6 kati roll from the pushcart on the corner.
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If you can’t afford 4 hours and $335 a person, Eleven Madison Park also offers a 6-course “bar tasting menu” alternative for $175 a pop.
oh, phew! here i was worried people might go hungry
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I sometimes feel this way about magic tricks.
When the trick is revealed and you realize how many hundreds of hours went into a momentary illusion, it sometimes leaves me feeling a little queasy in a spiritual sense that I find hard to describe.
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I liked a lot of his stuff but he was as guilty of bullshit toxic macho chef groupthink as very many of them.
If you can’t cook a delicious vegan meal you aren’t worth shit as a cook as far as I’m concerned.
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if you’ve seen any of my chili or barbecue recipes in the food thred, you know i’m conversant with the meats but i also have some vegan recipes i make simply because they are so good. i’m recovering from chemo these days but when i feel better, i’ll share a few of those over there.
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AGREE
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We’ve been enjoying our veggies on the grill this summer.
Also thick cut reverse sear steak.
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A recipe won’t help you. It’s the accumulated skillset and technique that allows these cooks to pull it off.
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Sure. But maybe the $335 menu (all 12 courses, not just the cucumber) is so sublime that anything else distracts from the experience. I once had a superb dish at a fancy spanish restaurant-- possibly rabbit, that sort of melted in my mouth, and people were trying to trade their rice dishes with me-- those were good-- but my entree was better and their paellas were almost a letdown in comparison.
and from bloomberg’s review:
We left our five-hour meal (most clock in at least four, once you count a visit to the kitchen) feeling like two ripe-to-bursting watermelons. It’s hard to imagine that anyone will go off in search of a Shake Shack burger across the street when they’re done.
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Groupthink? We must be thinking of two different guys, both named Anthony Bourdain. Happens, I suppose.
Read what he said again. Compare it to any other macho arsehole chef character.
He let himself down there with a piece of bang average groupthink.
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11 Madison is one of the best dining experiences I have had in my life, a few months prior to the pandemic. I wish them all the luck in the world but I won’t be paying $335 for a vegan meal.
I understand the elitism and classism on display here, but environmentally, I’m also excited to see some “high-roller early adopters” bringing vegan and vegetarian dining into the public discourse. This is an all around good.
Cooking at home, I totally agree. But regular restaurant mark-up is around 300% to account for energy, staff, etc. I guess if you don’t care whether or not your food was sustainably farmed and/or harvested (seafood), everything would come in under $25/meal. I think if you want a locally, humanely and ecologically raised steak (for instance) with a side of potatoes, at a place that pays a living wage instead of relying on tips, it probably would cost more than that. There’s more at play in the value proposition than just the flavor of the meal.
I generally like this guy, but this is so annoying. The pure enjoyment of food? How is someone else being a vegetarian ruining that for anyone else? And if bringing up the ecologically destructive nature of current farming practices makes some uncomfortable, well, it should. Make better choices. Think of the planet. Think of the children. If you can’t afford to buy responsibly raised meat, buy some fava* beans and make some delicious Egyptian style falafel instead. 
*best served with a glass of chianti, obviously.
ETA: Oops, sorry, didn’t mean to respond to you specifically @jhbadger, more a general thread response kind of thing.
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