Why (or why not) to vote for Hillary Clinton

wrath
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Millions of people who have jobs and healthcare now–who did not have jobs and healthcare in 2009, will say they are better off.

As far as why more people don’t have jobs and healthcare, here is a question you can ask.

How many more jobs and healthcare coverage would people have in states controlled by republicans, if those republicans would not be engaged in total obstruction and opposition?

We are talking about republican obstruction and opposition (to the detriment of their own citizens) based on the plain simple fact they don’t like President Obama for political, social and racial reasons.

Check the U.S Census record regarding the median family income in states controlled by democrats versus republican controlled states. The median family income is significantly higher in states controlled by democrats.

Despite total republican obstruction and opposition the economy has improved significantly. The U-3 unemployment rate is 5.0 % with still eleven (11) plus months to go in the administration of President Obama.

The U-3 unemployment rate will be even lower by the time President Obama leaves office, a amazing accomplishment given the 10.0 U-3 unemployment rate in October of 2009 at the height of the recession.–but then because President Obama is in office the goal posts have been changed,–and the U-3 unemployment rate is no longer a economic measurement for success to some people.

People living paycheck to paycheck can be cited during good economic times. How you manage your excess and lifestyle determines in a lot of cases whether you are living paycheck to paycheck.

There are a lot of upper middle class people who live paycheck to paycheck because they do not manage their money and attempt to live beyond their means. There are a lot of rich and wealthy people who live an excessive lifestyle who eventually go bankrupt.

On being wiped out because of a unexpected medical bill. Well the leading cause of bankruptcies in America is medical bills.

America is much better of today, because during committee debate for the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (PPACA), this subject was debated and addressed in one of the major reform pieces of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.

You have much less of a chance of going bankrupt because of excessive medical bills, because there is now a limit on out-of pocket costs.

This is a part of the PPACA that still needs more work–and why Hillary Clinton says there is still more work to be done.

PPACA limits out-of-pocket costs–still more work to be done

However most people are better off with the limits on out-of-pocket costs associated with the PPACA. Before the PPACA people and families were not just going bankrupt, they were losing their cars, homes and total life savings because of millions of dollars in medical builds that accompanied a catastrophic genetic disorder, illness or injury.

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Heavens. The great big meanie. I am clutching my pearls so tight right now at these shocking revelations.

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You mean he is not the one you claim he claims to be.

Back when i first hear of Bernie, and liked him, 25 years ago, his stickers had a BIG RED STAR on them. He is not a liberal or a progressive. Arguably he is a flavor of communist.

“:scream:”

He is a socialist, and we need one.

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Bernie has been very careful to point out that he is absolutely not a communist in any way. As he says, “I don’t believe the government should control the means of production, or take over the grocery store down the street.” His brand of socialism is based on fighting income inequality through higher taxes on the rich and higher minimum wages, and providing universal healthcare and higher education. It’s European-style socialism. It’s not any flavor of communism.

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I know I keep on being that person but I wish that people would stop assuming that socialism=government

In anarchist communism, the state and private property would no longer exist.

Many libertarian socialists argue that large-scale voluntary associations should manage industrial manufacture

Not that Bernie Sanders is either of those, I just wish someone who was running was. Until then Bernie is about as good as you are going to get.

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…is an oxymoron.

who’s going to enforce the rules against owning property exactly?

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Only in America, and the political education there isn’t worth shit. Everywhere else they are the original libertarians (that term was first used to describe Joseph Déjacque in the 1840s)

I have a whole argument about how ‘Libertarian’-Capitalists are neither libertarians or anarchists, as they are incredibly hierarchical and not willing to extend freedom to people working for them (except in an existential sense where you always have a choice because you have the freedom to kill yourself or something equally stupid). I really don’t want to do that (I’m feeling pretty shitty and my clinical depression is kicking in, see Fuck Today for the catalysts) but will if forced.

Remember that Ayn Rand hated being called an anarchist. This was because anarchists are socialists. It’s only been in the last 50 years that those frauds on the right have got away with claiming they are too.

Distinction of the term property is important here

Private Property - The means of production? You and your colleagues.

Personal property? No one should care if you have a television or computer, or how much underwear you have, it’s unimportant to the running of any community. If they do then they’re being an arsehole.

I recommend starting by reading What is Property? by P-J. Proudhon (a socialist, and the ‘father of Anarchism’)

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LOL @ the usanian definition of ‘libertarian’. It’s a travesty.

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@khepra FFS address this. Directly contradicting yourself so specifically deserves either an explanation or for you to admit you’re driving trollies and have been outed beyond your ability to spin.

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The eve of the first democratic presidential primary contest is upon us. The last poll taken before the Iowa Caucuses, the historically accurate and highly respected Des Moines Register and Bloomberg Politics poll shows Hillary Clinton with a three (3) point lead over Bernie Sanders, well within the margin of error. Hillary Clinton leads in final poll taken before the Iowa caucuses.

On the eve of the Iowa caucuses, the highly accurate and respected FiveThirtyEight.com, gives Hillary Clinton a 79% chance of winning the Iowa Caucuses. Hillary Clinton with a 79% chance of winning the Iowa caucuses.

What does this mean for Hillary Clinton, absolutely nothing at all!

I hope Hillary Clinton wins however, high or low turnout, staunch advocates making the case for their candidate, first time caucus goers–and each campaigns grassroots efforts to motivate and get its supporters to show up and enthusiastically caucus; will be the key to victory for Hillary or Bernie. It may be late in the night before we know who the winner of Iowa will be.

Here is a link to how the Iowa Democratic Caucuses work~

How the Iowa Caucuses work.

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I guess the Dems better field a candidate that I want to vote for, not just point at the GOP candidate and make a hissing sound.

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I’m voting my conscience, not just for any schmuck with “I’m not GOP” on a sticker on their forehead.

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The ‘don’t vote for the third party, you’ll let a Republican in’ canard is overblown. Particularly if, like you, you’re in somewhere as solidly Dem as CA and your vote doesn’t mean a damn thing in the grand scheme of things.

Clinton needs to be held accountable, not gifted votes whatever.

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They say they are in London. They really should know better.

What did they think those red and black flags that are in Trafalgar Square for every May Day march are for?

I’m going off topic so I will stop now.

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That was also a Bernie Sanders quote when he decided to run as a democrat.

He is referring the importance of not running as a third party candidate because it would help insure electing a republican to the White House.

Bernie Sanders joins 2016 Field–as a Democrat.

“…The dilemma is that, if you run outside of the Democratic Party … you’re not just running a race for president, you’re really running to build an entire political movement. In doing that, you would be taking votes away from the Democratic candidate and making it easier for some right-wing Republican to get elected—the [Ralph] Nader dilemma."–Bernie Sanders

Here is another excerpt from a interview with Bernie about not running as a third party candidate. Bernie Sanders joins democratic presidential field.

An independent candidacy could be appealing because of “huge frustration at both parties.” But the drawback was, he said, that it’s very difficult to get on the ballot in 50 states. And he emphasized that he would never run as a spoiler if it could lead to the election of a Republican president…

'…We’ve made that mistake in the past.”–Bernie Sanders

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I understand that, and it’s worth avoiding. But if you aren’t in a swing state it doesn’t matter who you vote for. E.g. No way is Clinton or Sanders losing WA state, whatever.

But I voted Green in the last UK election because I agreed with more of their platform than anyone else’s and I wanted to show the Labour Party they couldn’t take my vote for granted, and they weren’t offering enough policies I agreed with. They need to know they left lots of votes on their left.

Perhaps I shouldn’t have, because I was voting in a marginal that Labour should have taken from the Conservatives, but they failed miserably to win it anyway, regardless of what I did.

But hey, you genuinely like Clinton. So awesome, vote for her! But don’t be surprised at how many people choose to vote for candidates like Stein instead. I understand why Sanders won’t run as an independent, because he might genuinely take a lot of votes.

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Bernie Sanders prediction before the Iowa Caucus–a prediction he made more than once before the Iowa Caucus

“I believe that if we have a large voter turnout, if thousands of people — many of whom who have given up on the political process, many young people who have never participated in the political process — if they come out, we’re going to win,”–Bernie Sanders

Turnout for Iowa Caucus.

Iowa’s 2016 caucus attendance was a doozy.

Republicans counted more than 180,000 caucus goers, topping their 2012 attendance record of 121,503 by an estimated 60,000 people.

And while Democratic numbers weren’t completely tallied at the time of this publication, all indications pointed to a robust performance, although not likely to top the roughly 240,000 total who showed up in 2008 to vote for a Democratic rock-star field led by Barack Obama, John Edwards and Hillary Clinton.

Razor close, but still a good win for Hillary Clinton. Hillary lost Iowa to then Senator Barack Obama in 2008, she wins Iowa (which had a large voter turnout) in 2016. Hillary Clinton becomes the first female to win the Iowa Caucus. Harriet Tubman, Sojourner Truth, Alice Stone Blackwell, Antoinette Brown Blackwell, Lucy Stone, Jane Addams, Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Susan B. Anthony etc etc…would be so proud.

Exit polling revealed some good and bad news for both candidates. There was one particular point of good news for Hillary Clinton, as she moves past New Hampshire to states with more ethnically diverse democratic voters like: South Carolina, North Carolina, Georgia, Arkansas, Mississippi, other southern states, Ohio, Illinois, New York, California, etc.

Hillary Clinton has been championing the social and economic success America has experienced because of the policies of President Obama and the Democratic Party.

Should the next president: Generally continue Barack Obama’s policies (55%)–See CBS Iowa exit polling results.

55% is a good number for Iowa–this number should be higher in states with a more ethnically diverse democratic voters. This will be tested when the South Carolina primary is contested.

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I see you changed your forum logo to Nixon, but who is Stein?

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LOL. As far as victories go, it was a crushing defeat. Predicted to shit it in, but she had to rely on six coins flipping in her favour. She just scraped through, smelling kinda fishy.

If this is indicative of the situation nationwide, you can take ten points off Clinton’s poll numbers and give them to Bernie.

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