Why (or why not) to vote for Hillary Clinton

wrath
41

Stop wasting your breath; @khepra here may as well be a bot, given your chances of making a dent in the perverse Clinton love.

8 Likes
42

My point is that Bernie Sanders is no more a liberal and progressive than many others in the Democratic Party i.e. Hillary Clinton or President Obama.

Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton are competing for the Democratic Party nomination for president. They both are going to have to contrast themselves to each other, show there are differences between the two of them; and because of these differences, voters should vote for them over the other.

Bernie Sanders, his campaign and his loyal supporters have been attacking Hillary Clinton for not being a true liberal and progressive since the beginning of the democratic presidential nomination process. They have impugned Hillary’s commitment to liberal and progressive values; and they have impugned the liberal and progressive integrity of Hillary Clinton.

However, on the other side of the coin, Hillary Clinton her campaign and her loyal supporters have responded by pointing out that while Bernie, his campaign and loyal supporters are relentlessly impugning Hillary’s liberal and progressive integrity–Bernie is not immune to having held positions that were not always liberal and progressive in the past. Bernie like many other democrats has evolved on social and cultural issues as well.

Bernie is trending (like President Obama said “the bright shiny object that people haven’t seen before”). President Obama on the democratic presidential nomination race between Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders

No one in the Hillary Clinton camp is taking Bernie Sanders lightly. Bernie is a real and present threat to defeat Hillary Clinton for the democratic presidential nomination.

The democratic nomination for president will be a long battle of attrition, not a quick defeat for Hillary–Iowa and New Hampshire may very well bare that fact. The reason why is because Bernie like Hillary is qualified and experienced to be president. I feel that Hillary is more qualified and experienced.

I have stated before and again that I am a Hillary supporter, but if Bernie wins the democratic nomination I will support and campaign for him to be the 45th president of the United States.

The next president will be charged with appointing one, maybe two or three U.S.Supreme Court justices. With the republicans probably holding onto the U.S. House of Representatives, it is imperative for the direction of our country for there to be a democrat in the White House.

A republican president would be a disaster for America. With a republican president appointing one, maybe two or three new U.S. Supreme Court justices, it would be a disaster for same-sex marriage, Roe V. Wade, Civil Rights, Voting Rights, The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, immigration reform, equality for women and minorities etc…

Hillary and Bernie are the only experienced and qualified candidates running for president in 2016.

The republican candidates are an affront and a disgrace to political, social and cultural civility and reason; they are racist (some not all of them), sexist, discriminatory, anti-minorities, anti-LGBTQ, anti-same-sex marriage, anti-abortion, anti-Planned Parenthood, do not support women’s right to control their reproductive choices (like contraceptives).

Republicans are anti-environment, anti-climate change, anti-gun control, anti-Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (and Universal Healthcare), pro-voter suppression and repression, anti-union, anti-worker and middle class–anti #BlackLivesMatter, anti-Wall Street reform, anti-equal pay for women, anti-equal pay for minorities, anti-equal distribution of wealth…etc…etc…etc…

43

5 Likes
44

Judging from the eyes leftward movement and the look on this dogs face, he/she does not like the captions placed around it’s face. Probably a Hillary supporter thinking to his/her self.

“I don’t like this, I see you over there, what are you doing.”

I think I see a canine tooth showing on the left side side of his/her mouth–not a good sign.

45

Pro tip: unlike pretty much every other possessive, ‘its’ has no apostrophe, presumably because that’s reserved for the contraction of ‘it is’.

I wonder if you’ll ignore or distort that information?

2 Likes
46

9 Likes
47

I was sad when the scrolling ended. Bernie is the most successful Independent in US history. The suggestion that he got there by having the same views and personal evolution as the Democrats is… Many things. But true is not one of them.

7 Likes
48

Which of these is true?

9 Likes
49

People keep claiming that the economy has gotten better, but I have to ask for whom? Sure, we managed to claw our way out of the recession, but how many people can truly say they have fully recovered/doing better than they were before 2008? People keep using the stock market as a gage for how well a nation does as a whole, when it just shows how well Wall St and the Banks are doing.

How many people on this forum live paycheck to paycheck? How many would be completely wiped out by an unexpected medical/vet/repair bill?

I don’t call that a healthy economy. It is another pile of oily rags waiting for ignition.

This is kind of OT, but people here keep referencing the economy like it is something to be proud of.

7 Likes
50

Bernie had some nice things to say about President Obama after his scheduled visit at the White House today.

Bernie’s White House News Conference

Quote #1

“By and large, over the last seven years on major issue after major issue, I have stood by his side where he has taken on unprecedented Republican obstructionism and has tried to do the right thing for the American people”–Bernie Sanders

Quote #2

“What the president is trying to do is the right thing—and what he is trying to do is keep our young men and women in the military out of perpetual war in the quagmire of the Middle East–and what he is trying to do and what I will try to do, is put together a coalition of the major powers, with Muslim people on the ground—Muslim nations, troops.”–Bernie Sanders

51

You have a screw loose if you imagine you’re within a hundred miles of convincing anyone that Bernie is just another establishment honky.

4 Likes
52

Bernie Sanders ethnic descent is Jewish :scream:

The two quotes below are from the transcript of the 4th democratic presidential debate.

Bernie Sanders on President Obama~

SANDERS: …“In 2006 when I ran for the Senate, Senator Barack Obama was kind enough to campaign for me, 2008, I did my best to see that he was elected and in 2012, I worked as hard as I could to see that he was reelected. He and I are friends. We’ve worked together on many issues. We have some differences of opinion.”–Bernie Sanders

Bernie Sanders on the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act~

SANDERS…"I’m on the committee that wrote the Affordable Care Act. I made the Affordable Care Act along with Jim Clyburn a better piece of legislation. I voted for it, but right now, what we have to deal with is the fact that 29 million people still have no health insurance. We are paying the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs, getting ripped off.'–Bernie Sanders

53

If Bernie does not have many of the same views as the Democratic Party, then why is he running for the democratic nomination for president–say, instead of as a :smirk: republican or independent? :open_mouth:

Bernie Sanders is a Democrat.

Bernie Sanders joins 2016 Field–as a Democrat.

…As Sen. Bernie Sanders on Thursday announced a bid for president, he made official another momentous political decision: That he will seek higher office as a Democrat…

…Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, chairwoman of the Democratic National Committee, said in a statement: “Throughout his service in the U.S. House and Senate, Bernie Sanders has clearly demonstrated his commitment to the values we all share as members of the Democratic Party…”

“…The dilemma is that, if you run outside of the Democratic Party … you’re not just running a race for president, you’re really running to build an entire political movement. In doing that, you would be taking votes away from the Democratic candidate and making it easier for some right-wing Republican to get elected—the [Ralph] Nader dilemma."–Bernie Sanders

54

You are like a dog with lockjaw. No, Bernie is an Independent first and a Democrat second. Remember your history. I shouldn’t have to explain to you why he’s seeking the Democratic nomination.

There are subtleties here that continually elude your grasp. Yes, he has some of the same views as Democrats and some that are not the same. What is your point?

This is basically it, in a nutshell. You are not convincing anyone of anything @khepra In fact, you are unconvincing us more due to your lack of appreciation for history and facts.

3 Likes
55

Despite the fact that Bernie Sanders is trending in Iowa and ahead in New Hampshire, Bernie Sanders is now going negative with this new campaign ad obviously attacking Hillary Clinton.

Bernie and his campaign know that Iowa and New Hampshire are not reflective of the broader and more diverse Democratic Party electorate—and once outside of Iowa and New Hampshire Bernie faces a difficult and long primary battle against Hillary Clinton.

The new campaign ad is surprising and rather shocking given the fact that Bernie Sanders has consistently said he would not run a negative campaign against Hillary Clinton—forget about breaking campaign promises after one is elected, this is an example of breaking a campaign promise in-time and during an actual campaign.

But remember that during the November democratic presidential debate in front of the entire nation, Bernie Sanders impugned the integrity of Hillary Clinton by bringing up Wall Street. This has been a theme of the Bernie Sanders attack against Hillary Clinton.

The below quotes are from the transcript of the November democratic presidential debate.

BERNIE SANDERS—“Not good enough. Here’s the story. I mean, you know, let’s not be naive about it. Why do-- why over her political career has Wall Street a major-- the major-- campaign contributor to Hillary Clinton? You know, maybe they’re dumb and they don’t know what they’re gonna get. But I don’t think so….”

BERNIE SANDERS—“I have never heard a candidate, never, who’s received huge amounts of money from oil, from coal, from Wall Street, from the military industrial complex, not one candidate, go, “OH, these-- these campaign contributions will not influence me. I’m gonna be independent.” Now, why do they make millions of dollars of campaign contributions? They expect to get something. Everybody knows that. Once again, I am running a campaign differently than any other candidate. We are relying on small campaign donors, $750,000 and $30 apiece. That’s who I’m indebted to.”

Excerpts below are from a MSNBC article about Bernie Sanders new Wall Street Ad that is not “directed at Hillary Clinton exclusively”

Sanders spokesperson Michael Briggs said the ad is not “directed at Secretary Clinton exclusively.” “It’s about people in the Democratic establishment who believe you can take Wall Street’s money and then somehow turn around and rein in the greed, recklessness and illegal behavior,” he said in a statement to MSNBC.

“Obviously she is part of the establishment that Wall Street has showered with financial support. Bernie is not. She wants Wall Street and corporate special interests to like her. Bernie does not.”

Last month, Sanders’ campaign abruptly took down and disowned a digital advertisement that said Hillary Clinton was “bank-funded” while Sanders was “people powered.” “We haven’t been doing ads that mention Hillary Clinton,” Briggs told the Washington Post at the time, chalking up the existence of the ad to a “a miscommunication” among the campaign’s staff.

Still, the the campaign has posted non-sponsored content to its Facebook page with messages like, “Hillary Clinton May Have Wall Street, But Bernie Sanders Has You.”

During the first two Democratic debates, Sanders’ spokesperson sent opposition research to reporters noting that Clinton’s top lifetime donors include Citigroup, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase.

56

With his approval rating up (for now anyway), unemployment rates down and gas prices down—President Obama was upbeat as he addressed the U.S. House democrats at their “Issues Meeting” in Baltimore, Maryland.

President Obama predicts a democrat will succeed him in the White House

President Obama declared definitively that a Democrat will succeed him next year, telling a gathering of House Democrats his confidence stems from his belief that Democrats have the American people’s best interest at heart. Democrats will win in November, he told the House Democratic caucus during their issues meeting in Baltimore, Md.

‘We are on the right side of this debate, " he said. “We-re not cynical we genuinely believe that everybody should get a shot.”

During this election season there’s a lot of noise and a lot of talk about America in decline, the President added, continuing the optimistic rhetoric that has become a theme during the last half of his second term. And as I said at the State of the Union I don-t believe it and the facts don-t show it.

“The press has been focused on debates and divisions that they can drum up in the party, he said. “I’m not worried about this party staying united.”

57

Is it negative if it’s true? Should we just ignore who is invested in her campaign? It matters, I’m afraid. Corporations are not neutral parties, they are politically invested parties, who have shifted the goal posts in political speech in dangerous ways, thanks in part to candidates who see no alternative to taking corporate funds. We need big donors out of the system. No corporations should be allowed to contribute and we should all get the same cap for contributions.

9 Likes
58

Staying home or voting for a third party candidate in 2016 will only help the Republican Party win the White House.

Your concern is why we need a democrat in the White House in 2016. The next president will in all probability be charged with appointing one (1) maybe two (2) or three (3) new U.S. Supreme Court Justices.

Campaign Finance Reform is one of the many reasons as it relates to the U.S. Supreme Court and the direction of America, why I feel that no matter who wins the democratic presidential nomination (Hillary or Bernie), we need keep a democrat in the White House.

The question is will your ideal limits and restrictions on campaign contributions (which I support) hold up under a 14th Amendment constitutional challenge before the U.S. Supreme Court.

It is not just corporations, the entire campaign finance system is broken. Corporations even if they cannot contribute as a corporation, can simply have its individual members target and contribute (in mass) to a specific candidate, political party etc. etc…with the same results.

FEC allowed campaign contributions are way to much

To much money can be contributed by a: Individual, National Political Party, State, District & Local Party Committee, PAC (multi candidate)[3], PAC (not multi candidate) and Authorized Campaign Committee

Individuals who contribute to political candidates or a political party are also not neutral, they are politically invested and committed to a particular candidate (like Bernie Sanders supporters and contributors).

Individuals who contribute to a political candidate or political party also expect certain actions from that candidate or political party that in many cases will benefit them or their political, social, and cultural ideology.

I agree with you on campaign finance reform.

At minimum there should be a limit on how much money a individual can contribute, say $2,000 or less–and there should be a limit of how much money a corporation can contribute, say $5,000 or less.

All political contributions should be public record and available for the public to see who are the individuals and corporations that are contributing to a political candidate, political party etc etc…

1 Like
59

Who is contributing to a politician should be public record and fair political game.

Saying a person is corrupt or implying that a person is corrupt based on who gives to their campaign is theory, conjecture i.e. speculation. Speculation is one of the problems with Wall Street.

Bernie Sanders voted to deregulate Wall Street when he voted for the ‘Commodity Futures Modernization Act’ in 2000.

Bernie Sanders builds himself as the ultimate champion of Wall Street reform, this is a major theme of his campaign for president in 2016.

Is it fair to speculate that if Bernie Sanders was unaware that a provision to deregulate Wall Street was in a bill to keep the government open, a bill that he eventually voted for–does that mean that Bernie Sanders cannot be trusted to understand complex legislation and keep America safe from Wall Street excess, greed and corruption?

Bernie Sanders one (1) pro-Wall Street vote

“This was an era in which voting against funding the federal government was considered a major governance faux pas. The bill sailed through both chambers of Congress, with few lawmakers even aware of the major new deregulatory changes.”

As I mentioned in another post Bernie did not have to vote for the ‘Commodity Futures Modernization Act’–the votes were there to keep the government open. Bernie could have stood up in debate and objected to the included provision–and he could have waited until the votes were secured for passage to keep the government open–and then voted “no.”

Is it fair to speculate that Bernie actually supported the ‘Commodity Futures Modernization Act’ as did then President Bill Clinton who signed it into law.

Bernie Sanders vote for the “Commodity Futures Modernization Act”

The law effectively gave bankers, or “sophisticated traders,” free rein from pre-existing oversight mechanisms when they wanted to make deals on the sidelines of the major stock exchanges, in “over-the-counter” trading.

Clinton himself would later cop to having made a serious mistake in signing the bill, saying he didn’t understand the extent to which these deals, if they went bad, could ripple across the global economy.

“Even if less than 1% of the total investment community in derivative exchanges, so much money was involved that if they went bad, they could effect 100% of the investments,” he told ABC’s “This Week” in 2010.
.

Has Bernie in any of the democratic presidential debates or on the campaign trail said his vote was a mistake? Former president Bill Clinton has stated that his signing of the bill into law was a mistake.

60

If I weren’t voting for Bernie already, your tedious copypasta bullshit would have pushed me over the fence. Good job!

8 Likes