Comsidering that a nonzero number of people get shot during gun safety training, perhaps it was appropriate that Jordan was first given a mustard yellow toy gun.
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As I said, you can find examples that fit this description. No, I donât think it is âcommonâ. Of course these people exist, yes I realize that is who they satire was aimed at. No, I donât think the generalization is fair nor accurate.
I can find you many examples of young black males killing and robbing people, but that in no way validates the caricature of ALL black young males as âthugsâ. And when you look at the statistics, I donât even think can say black âthugsâ are âcommonâ among the populace in general.
â cliche alert â
America: put men on the moon, invented Coke, the Atom Bomb, and the Internet; poured close to 4.4 million cubic yards of concrete to build the Hoover Dam, drilled 85 miles of tunnel through solid rock for the Delaware aqueduct in NY, and how long is Interstate 95? I-10?
Rampant number of gun deaths and massacres in America: ÂŻ\(ă)/ÂŻ
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I realize that gun control topics are kind of âyour thingâ and you are very vocal about your position - Iâm not about to change your mind any more than youâre going to change those opposed to gun proliferation.
My response however is specific to the âgun cultureâ that organizations like the NRA promote using fear tactics to scare the gullible into arming themselves.
You state that your readings thru forums (I assume these are gun related forums) where âNO ONEâ thinks itâs a good idea to insert themselves into active shooter situations âunless theyâre in the middle of itâ. Iâm not talking about these guys - people who are already knowledgeable on gun safety and aware of their responsibilities.
Iâm talking about the scared housewife who stashes a gun under her seat because of that one time she was involved in a road-rage situation (I personally know a women who did this). This type of person is truly dangerous as she neither bothered to train herself or otherwise seek knowledge on the proper usage, storing and handling of firearms. My position is that there is a large segment of these type of people that are most at risk for blindly inserting themselves into situations they are neither trained or prepared for.
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I think you are giving the NRA too much credit/blame.
Fear? That is every where you turn, from local news, to the big cable news, to the government. There is plenty of reason for fear with out seeing a single NRA promo (which I personally almost never see, and when I do it is on a gun site or something, never in the wild.)
I completely agree that there are some under trained people out there. I would implore them to seek more training. Not the active shooter scenarios in the skit. Those are super unlikely and something one should do everything they can to avoid. Mainly more proper daily handling and regular marksmanship. (If you know someone like this, I would implore your to prompt her to get more training. It will make it safer for her and the people around her, and, god forbid, she actually has to use it in defense she will be more likely to succeed and not get in trouble for using it at the wrong time.)
But at the same time, I do believe these are in the minority of concealed carry people. Though I think that number goes up more for people who just keep them in their homes.
At the same time, handling a gun safely is INCREDIBLY easy. They poked fun at the question on the test but that is one of the 4 cardinal rules of gun handling. And as long as you obey the first rule, even if you screw up the other 3, no one will get hurt.
That accident rate is only 800 a year out of 80 million plus gun owners. I think that is a very reasonable safety rate, especially when you factor in some of those accidental deaths are actually suicides ruled as such.
So in conclusion, the #1 problem with gun death is actually suicides. But just like I am not gong to pass laws to prevent abortions, I am not going to pass laws to stop you from hurting yourself. âRegularâ gun crime accounts for the most deaths and is what we should focus on. âMass Shootingsâ, which is rather ill defined and sort of an arbitrary label, account for a very small number of gun deaths. While the scariest, and most sensational, making them the focus will have little to no affect on the bigger problems. And finally accidents are accidents and very small. Promoting education is what is needed.
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Which is odd, because everyone I have seen comment on various situations, not just actual shootings but also unfolding, potential situations (i.e. proper fights down to kids just messing) have all stated they would have liked to been there and armed so they could have helped sorted out the situation. Some of these people are friends, some friends of friends.
In none of these cases would I have felt happy about them putting me and everyone else in even more danger by them joining in a free for all criminal activity.
How can we possibly both be correct?!?
I wonder if sample size, statistics and confirmation bias has the answer?
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Really? The whole âgood guy with gunâ meme came directly from the NRA and they are responsible for inserting this myth into our collective consciousness. Itâs an emotional appeal to that reptilian fear center of the mind that convinces the masses into believing theyâre going to be a victim of the next terrorist attack unless they arm themselves.
Also relevant is the fact that gun sales soar after each mass shooting - again due to pants-pissing fear that the media whips up after every event. The NRA shamelessly exploits these situations to promote their âeveryone must own a gunâ agenda.
Recall also the recent Co Springs active shooter situation where a gun-carrying civilian shows up to the scene offering his âassistanceâ to the responding officers. The Rambo mentality is real and should not be lightly dismissed.
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The simple fact of the matter is adding guns to the mix radically skews the inevitable mistakes toward far more death and destruction.
I think we should allow citizens to have nukes â but only when stored in safe, locked containers, and only after proper licensing and training. Iâm sure the occasional mistake, if there even are any, wonât be a problem.
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Well I donât know what the context was. Facebook âbravadoâ? Yeah, sure, I have seen that. Shooting the shit with the guys at the bar? People mouth off all the time about shit. Some of them even like to tell you how much they wear the pants in the household - when the spouse isnât within ear shot.
I am talking about when people were having an earnest discussion. Like, âHa ha, no really, what would you do?â The overwhelming majority are of the opinion they would do what they have to keep themselves and their loved one safe. If they were out of direct danger, they would not go seek it. There of course were some who said they would do what they could - if it didnât put them in too much direct risk of being killed by either the assailant or cops. Most Cops on the forum of course, even though they donât actually have the duty to do so, said they would go after an assailant even if not on active duty, but they do generally not only have more training, but badges to identify them etc.
[quote=âanon81034786, post:27, topic:70808â]
Really? The whole âgood guy with gunâ meme came directly from the NRA and they are responsible for inserting this myth into our collective consciousness. [/quote]
Fair point, I guess it came from them, but media and politicaisn repeating it is what put it into the collective consciousness. And at the hear of the matter, they ARE correct. Violence is often solved with more violence. If you are being attacked it will stop when either 1) you or someone else stops it, 2) you die, 3) the assailant decides not to keep attacking you.
âGood guy with a gunâ is a simplified concept of this idea, but it is correct. In crime and mass shootings, it is one of those three outcomes that stops an attack. MOST of the time the attack stops because the victim is dead or incapacitated enough the attacker leaves. However if the attacker is someone trying to kill as many people as possible, they will continue to attack until someone stops them or they are presented a situation where they are trapped and they kill themselves.
ETA - and while another person with a gun may STOP a crime, it doesnât appear to PREVENT crime (maybe, the stats on that are murky). If we are talking prevention we should be talking about something else other than this.
[quote=âanon81034786, post:27, topic:70808â]
Also relevant is the fact that gun sales soar after each mass shooting - again due to pants-pissing fear that the media whips up after every event. The NRA shamelessly exploits these situations to promote their âeveryone must own a gunâ agenda.[/quote]
Yeah yeah, people are skittish, reactionary creatures. Though the sales I think are far less prompted over fear of attack, vs fear of legislation. I havenât seen a spike in ownership to coincide with this, so I think it is people who own guns buying more for fear they wonât be able to later. I also know causal owners who just had the idea to âget something some dayâ, and they are prompted by the calls for legislation to make a move on it.
I am dismissing it because it is basically a non-issue. Youâre worrying about a handful of well intentioned people screwing up. Yes you can find me examples, but while you point out how horrible this splinter is, youâre bleeding out from the missing foot that is regular criminals commiting crime.
Ugh - the tired argument that âwell if you donât allow everyone to own nukes, then we shouldnât let everyone have guns.â Explosives are not the same thing as fire arms.
Yeah, thatâs the thing - theyâve done surveys of the people who have claimed to use guns in self-defense, and they found that in most cases, they had been the aggressors who were escalating a situation by pulling out a gun and threatening people with it.
The statistics are so obviously bad, I donât think we can say people are getting confused: For every time a gun is used in self-defense in the home (that is, in a legally justified shooting), there are 7 assaults/murders, 11 suicides/attempts, and 4 accidental shootings in the home. Thatâs not a failure to understand statistics, thatâs simply flatly denying that the statistics apply to you. Everyone wants to think theyâre the special snowflake thatâs smarter, more competent, more safe than anyone else, even when theyâre clearly not doing anything differently than anyone else.
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Dang it Cory Doctorow. Why you post things we canât watch in Canada? 
âIâm never going to want to commit suicide because mental states never change!â Iâm always a little disturbed by how quickly people dismiss the suicide statistics as not applying to them. It tells me that people still donât really understand mental illness.
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Duh! The bad guys show up in red in your reticle. The good guys are green. And you switch off the âfriendly fireâ option just in case.
Thatâs how it works in real life!
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All those example are true, but decades old.
America doesnât do cool stuff anymore, like build things.
We are no longer prepared to deal with large problems.
Sounds like youâre surprised that a satire show uses sarcasm and mockery to get the point across.
Perhaps Matlock or SVU is more your speed.
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What makes you think shaddack, awjt, and I donât already? (But to be fair awjts and my nukes are our chili and curry respectively)
(Also the gun debate in the US is as ridiculous as my previous joke)
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Is Washington a western state? Because itâs perfectly legal to open carry shotguns and rifles with the only requirement being that youâre over 18
In Washington a Concealed Pistol License (while necessary to even possess a pistol outside oneâs home, or to transport a pistol in a vehicle) requires filling out an application with your ID, and paying a nominal fee. There is no requirement for education or safety training. Just a background check.
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Same logic works with cops. Less guns carried, less accidental (or intentional, in some casesâŚ) shootings by cops. Plenty of police forces in the world that donât carry guns, I think.
Simple game of statistics, really. A certain percent of people will, being human, screw up. And the potential danger from a screwup with a gun is way higher than, say, pepper spray or a baton.
Or a nuke.
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I am not being flippant with this remark, not even a little:
- I trust you with a firearm
- I donât trust my father, my late grandfather, my brother, or myself.
- So I am not a fan of firearms.
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