Bye Felicia! Hopefully you get hit with a felony conspiracy charge on Your way out the door!!!
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Thanks for posting this. Also being discussed in this topic:
The phrenology enthusiasts at Quillette basically kept this kapo on the masthead until he got caught (the most unforgivable sin for right-wingers).
It also makes this comment, from less than two weeks ago, even more ridiculous than it was at the time.
Attempts to smear him as a far-right activist are bulshit, heâs a moderate conservative at worst, seems pretty liberal on many issues
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Nothing in that video makes that comment appear ridiculous. Embedding himself with far right as a journalist, is no different from other journalists embedding themselves with problematic groups in war zones. Iâm yet to see any evidence he actually has any far right beliefs. The sum total of the evidence against him seems to be that he follows far right protesters around, and doesnât like antifa. As I said before, I think Andy is an idiot. At worst he is shown to be a useful idiot for the far right at times, given his shitty grasp of where the priorities here lie.
So in your view an opportunist who actively co-operates with fascists, who laughs with them as the plan to initiate violence, and who an undercover member of PP says has a mutual protection arrangement with the fascists, and who has a documented history of promoting alt-right causes and writing for an alt-right outlet is a âmoderate conservativeâ. Okey dokey, then.
Really? Is that what youâre going with? That one got an out-loud laugh from me.
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None of those claims is true as far as I can tell. Can you provide any evidence for any of them? and lol @ calling Quillette alt-right, if theyâre alt-right the term has really lost all meaning (much like how âneoliberalâ is used to describe any economic policy someone on the left doesnât like). More from the âanyone I disagree with is a Naziâ school of discourse.
Itâs probably also worth pointing out that Patriot Prayer arenât a fascist or white supremacist group, theyâre more radical libertarians. Shitty people for other reasons perhaps, and theyâre definitely in bed with actual fascists to some degree who turn up at their events. But an important distinction none the less.
I think whether or not it is an important distinction is debatable.
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If youâre proudly marching alongside Nazis then Iâm gonna go ahead and tar you by association.
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Me too, doesnât mean theyâre as bad. Hierarchies of shittiness can exist. Just like modern antifa arenât as bad as the original Stalinist brand.
Wait so this is your point?
How is âantifaâ either radical socialsm or anarchism, though?
I mean I guess if people are saying âTrump is on the same path as Nazi germanyâ then you could technically say âantifa is on the same path as Nazi germanyâ?
Except Iâm quite sure nobody in US antifa is an actual communist⌠that seems like an important distinction to make. I got the impression they were mostly opposed to far right figures here, with no particular ideology other than âthese other guys suck and need to be resistedâ?
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I donât waste time trying to sort shit by hierarchy. The least-stinky turds get flushed along with the rest.
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If by that you mean âAntifa is on the same path as people who violently opposed fascism in Nazi Germanyâ I can get on board with the metaphor. Almost certainly some of those guys were nasty assholes too, but as a group they were still on the right side of history.
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Already done in previous comments in the linked topic, as well as in this topic starter. I have no problem letting them stand. If you still insist on believing Ngoâs some neutral, disinterested reporter who âembeddedâ himself with a fascist street gang, youâre just showing yourself to be more naive or disingenuous than Quillette, which had enough sense to dump his sorry kapo arse because they know he got caught.
Theyâre currently known primarily for featuring writers who are, in one way or another, known ârespectableâ gateways to the alt-right: Jordaddy, Ben Shapiro, Joe Rogan, etc. The outlet features other, more liberal writers, but for the most part the outlet is basically a bastion of IDW ârenegadesâ and âfirebrandsâ who somehow always come down in defense of the same Western capitalist patriarchy that the neo-fascists the outlet claims to oppose also defend (more violently and coarsely than the highfalutin editors of Quillette would prefer).
Oh.My.God. Cracking up here.
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The communism bit is very much missing in the USA, and I think without that the case for âthese dudes are just as badâ becomes⌠a completely unsupportable statement.
Maybe theyâre just anarchists, but ⌠I doubt it.
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antifa was originally an explicitly Stalinist organisation, directly run from Moscow. the current incarnation has a wider membership, made up of anti-capitalists of various stripes.
lots of people in antifa today really are actual revolutionary communists, more of them are some stripe of anarchist, libertarian socialist, what have you. in many ways that is a distinction without a difference though, as the end result would be the same authoritarian nightmare in all cases (in a way that various extreme right ideologies wouldnât necessarily devolve to inescapable authoritarianism, see many examples in history of peaceful transition from far-right authoritarian regimes to liberal democracies).
Theyâve definitely attracted some Anarkiddies of the sort that used to cause vandalism at anti-WTO protests in the 1990s and at the anti-war protests in the early 2000s, but people who literally canât tell the difference between Emma and Sachs when you mention âGoldmanâ arenât true anarchists in my book.
In any case, the antifa as a general movement have prevented these attention-seeking entryists from behaving as they have in the past.
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Antifa, at least in its current incarnation, is a purely reactive movement. Even at their absolute worst itâs silly to portray them as an equal threat as the people they oppose.
If you get rid of the fascists, White Nationalists and Alt-right then Antifa pretty much goes away.
If you get rid of Antifa then the fascists, White Nationalists and Alt-right keep doing their thing.
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This is what kneejerk defenders of the âfreeâ market and supposedly moderate conservatives never grasp as they split hairs and make excuses for those who vote for, support, get into bed with (as in Ngoâs case), or otherwise enable fascists.
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Even a stopped clockâŚ
::raises hand::
Well, with a slight quibble that there isnât really such a thing as being âin antifaâ which is really saying âis antifascistâ.
There is no club, no organization beyond small autonomous collectives which form around achieving specific goals with respect to antifascist work. Any coordination between these groups is primarily spontaneous and centered around direct confrontations ie opposing PP/PB hate rallies.
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were you under the misapprehension that I thought antifa were just as bad as the far-right? despite repeatedly saying otherwise? my main problem with modern antifa isnât even that they might turn out as bad as they used to be the soviet era, not impossible, but unlikely in the modern US. itâs more their impact in increasingly radicalising the public discourse, which plays into the hands of the far right (much like the original antifa also did, via their opposition to social democrats and increasing public sympathy amongst non-fascists towards actual fascists). if antifa didnât show up and engage in street fights with these assholes, theyâd just walk around in their pathetically small numbers with a police escort and go home again.
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