What’s next, using a phone while pumping gas? Madness!
“If it seems odd that flight attendants would hate passenger-mollifying entertainment boxes”
Ex-flight attendant here - Yeah, they’re great, until you have to do something that takes people’s attention away from their entertainment boxes for more than three seconds at a time. Like, say, the saftey demo, or simple questions about if they’d like a drink, or a snack. That’s just a recipe to get snapped at, insulted, or otherwise chewed out by every traveling arsehole you see.
I don’t agree with the AFA, but seriously, never underestimate how much of a prick anyone can be for any(or no) reason while they’re traveling, particularly when personal entertainment devices are involved.
RyanAir, for all its suckiness, does not tend to make the devices an issue. Climb, descend, whatever, you can read your ebook or listen to your mp3s without anybody giving you crap about it.
I know, I flew with them a few times in the UK. Here’s my one-sentence review: they should change their motto to “You get what you pay for.”
Still, I’m not disagreeing. I’m just putting forward from experience a reason why the magic personal pax-be-quiet boxes are not all singing and all dancing wonders.
I am thinking about a tshirt for traveling, “It could be worse, it could be Ryanair”, But it is good enough to get from point A to point B, and their lost-luggage stats are so far favorable.
On the other hand, once you saw the safety instructions the 1000th time, you know the spiel, and as a frequent flier you also know to buy the water from the machine after the screening (and the solid snacks in a landside supermarket a day before) as it’s considerably cheaper…
…still no reason to snap at the attendants; a mild head-shake on the offer always did the job for me in a second.
…also, a question. Do the flight attendants learn the passenger entry assistance job at boarding schools?
On the other hand, once you saw the safety instructions the 1000th time,
you know the spiel, and as a frequent flier you also know to buy the
water from the machine after the screening (and the solid snacks in a
landside supermarket a day before) as it’s considerably cheaper…
Know the spiel, hell, I can still rap the whole thing out at the drop of a hat. But there’s two points - not every airframe is the same, and it’s really just a politeness thing. We know you don’t want to listen, but we also have an obligation to do it for you, so it’s nice when you do pay attention. I mean, when we’re flying, we listen - it’s two minutes of our time, and we know that the crew notice. People always ask “What’s something I can do to keep the flight attendants on my flight happy”, that’s one of them.
…still no reason to snap at the attendants; a mild head-shake on the offer always did the job for me in a second.
I know, right? But hey, that’s people, I guess.
…also, a question. Do the flight attendants learn the passenger entry assistance job at boarding schools?
I’ll admit, I straight up belly-laughed at that one. Ten points.
In all seriousness, training is about 6-10 weeks, and a lot of tests. Industry standard is an 80% pass mark for most tests, many airlines will be looking at you very carefully if you don’t sail past 90%. Certain tests are 100% pass mark. Failing on training twice(And some places, once) is grounds for dismissal. Re-training is yearly, plus yearly re-ups for your CPR and aviation first aid, plus the chance of random selection, and failing during re-training is often grounds for dismissal. Of that, the part that comprises 90% of the time you spend on the aircraft, passenger service, is usually about 3-5 days. Every shift starts with what amounts to a brief pop-quiz and grooming check, and yes, fail badly enough or on something important enough, and they’ll put you off shift. Do it too many times, and it’s a disciplinary.
Plus, you have to carry your manual at all times, and back when I was flying, that’s one of those big, thick ring-binders, full enough that the covers are basically exactly parallel, and you’re expected to basically know it cover to cover.
Edit - Also, that’s in Australia, where I first learned, and is pretty accurate to England, too. Experiences may vary in the US, but all my US-based industry mates tell me it’s pretty similar.
Please list an airline that “you get what you pay for.” but is better than intensely uncomfortable, incredibly expensive, and a huge hassle?
I’d really like to know if there is a “good” airline given that I fly constantly and have used more or less every airline.
And no “well you should spring for 1st/business class” cause yeah… that isn’t happening with any company/business ever.
I first read headline as “Anti-gadget flight attendants lose it in court” and was expecting footage of people rioting, but only after asking the jury to return their seatbacks to the full upright position.
sorry for the selective edit, but TRUTH right there.
How is this different from someone reading a book or a newspaper?
While I agree with this, to a degree… Paper books and magazines are just as good at distracting people as a Kindle, or an iPad where you’re just playing Angry Birds with no headphones on. If you’re going to ban gadgets as a distraction during the safety demo, you have to ban ALL distractions.
Edit: doy, helps if I read down to the end of the comment thread… Especially when there’s only 11 comments prior to mine. 
Two minutes in a tube jam-packed with people can feel QUITE long without a distraction. 
(My pet peeve with the demos is that there is usually no reasoning behind it; no mention of the insidiousness of hypoxia at the mentioning of take-your-own-mask-first, no mention of need to go below surface during flooded airframe egress for not inflating the vest, so on… Such reasoning should be standard for ALL instructions everywhere, ground or air; I for one find it difficult to remember what to do without the why.)
As of difference between the airframes, is there some comparison table somewhere? Do they differ in other things than the exact location of the exit doors?
(A major annoyance of flying for me is the lower cabin air pressure. It robs my brain of oxygen just enough to not focus to a book that is not trivial, and not enough to sleep. It’s there for the airframe mechanical load reduction, but could it be alleviated with e.g. molecular filter slightly enriching the cabin air with oxygen to maintain the ground-level pO2?
…interesting thing I stumbled over when trying to find an answer: https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aircraft/amt_airframe_handbook/media/ama_Ch16.pdf )
(Todo: fly once with a pulse oximeter and a barometric sensor, attached to a datalogger. I did it once with a Geiger counter and the results were textbook.)
(Also, todo later if I get hands on a portable mass spectrometer, let it run during the flight to check for the aerotoxic syndrome causing chemicals in the air.)
[quote=“churba, post:7, topic:57158”]
Know the spiel, hell, I can still rap the whole thing out at the drop of a hat. But there’s two points - not every airframe is the same, and it’s really just a politeness thing. We know you don’t want to listen, but we also have an obligation to do it for you, so it’s nice when you do pay attention. I mean, when we’re flying, we listen - it’s two minutes of our time, and we know that the crew notice. People always ask “What’s something I can do to keep the flight attendants on my flight happy”, that’s one of them.
[/quote]Why is half the speech about seat belts when they have literally walked the length of the plane and made sure everyone has their seat belt on? For me that’s kind of the main issue with this thing is that it’s acknowledging from moment one “here’s this thing we know you know that we are required by law to say out loud”
Seriously, I don’t mind listening to flight attendants, but it’s kind of like spending time having them tell us how to find our seats.
Qantas, V Australia, Virgin Australia, British airways, basically any middle eastern airline but Etihad and Emirates in particular, Thai, JAL,. In the US? Er…Jetblue? I don’t know. I don’t fly much in the US anymore, and was never a US flight attendant. Sorry.
Still, you seem pretty defensive, considering. That’s basically the philosophy Ryanair lives by - we provide it so cheap, because you get what you pay for…and not one iota more. And for that, they’re competent and efficient.
That’s basically in service of keeping it brief and simple. Plus, I’ll be honest, 3/4 of the passengers aren’t listening anyway, so why bother giving them an extra five minutes of unnecessary information to ignore?
We’re there to keep an eye on you, and handle any symptoms of hypoxia, or recognize them in ourselves. If it’s a situation where masks are dropping for some reason, chances are we can’t do anything about it. So why give people more to worry about?
[quote=“shaddack, post:13, topic:57158”]
As of difference between the airframes, is there some comparison table somewhere? Do they differ in other things than the exact location of the exit doors?
[/quote]Yes, actually. How said doors work is a big one, locations of saftey equipment(in general, your stuff is usually under your seat), how the slides work, so on. But I don’t know if there’s a publically available chart. I’ll have a look around.
(Also, todo later if I get hands on a portable mass spectrometer, let it run during the flight to check for the aerotoxic syndrome causing chemicals in the air.)
Not my area, I’m afraid. But I’m pretty sure Aerotoxic syndrome is made up, for one simple reason - if it wasn’t, you’d see it in literally every flight attendant, and you don’t. Along with the fact that absolutely no aviation organization recognizes it or has ever found any evidence of it’s existence, nor has any aeromedical organization or study.
I don’t mean to pooh-pooh your thoughts on the matter, I’m just very, very skeptical of any medical condition that isn’t recognized by the medical establishment, despite extensive study.
[quote=“SteampunkBanana, post:14, topic:57158”]
Why is half the speech about seat belts when they have literally walked the length of the plane and made sure everyone has their seat belt on?
[/quote]Well, that’s easy to answer. Both are required by law.
And of course, there’s a difference between telling people something(Which should happen first, I might add) and making sure they’re actually doing it. Plenty of assholes out there don’t want to belt up, citing such strong and compelling arguments as “Well if the plane crashes I’m dead anyway, so why wear it?” or “It’s a little uncomfortable.”
[quote=“SteampunkBanana, post:14, topic:57158”]
Seriously, I don’t mind listening to flight attendants, but it’s kind of like spending time having them tell us how to find our seats.[/quote]True, but with some of the dumb, mad, and bad shit I’ve seen in the air, I’d almost advocate mandatory straightjackets and sedation. Which would make the meal service easier, if nothing else. That shit in Fifth element, where they tap the button and everyone drops off to sleep in their bunks? That’s a dream come true, if it would just hurry up and get to the “come true” part.
And that’s why we ignore the rest of it. So much of it is rote “I have to say this even though it’s pointless” that the useful information is lost in the noise. Start with “When shit goes wrong and Lost looks like goddamned paradise you’ll wish you were listening. Now, check for exists and count some rows to find the closest one. It’s gonna get dark and it’s gonna get smokey. You guys with that legroom? It doesn’t come for free, know how to get rid of those doors, but only when I tell you to. You drop those early and kill us all when water comes in and we are all going to be pissed. Now, let’s talk about seatbelts…”
You get to that point and they’ll be paying attention. But if it’s being done by rote, don’t be surprised you get tuned out.
The closest you’re going to get is called “Stop talking and let me just watch the movie I have on my iPad.”
However they don’t seem concerned about letting the passengers connect their devices to the same communications network which is used to control the aircraft. http://tech.slashdot.org/story/15/04/15/1437211/gao-warns-faa-of-hacking-threat-to-airliners
Oh, how I wish we could do that. Some airlines are starting to move that way. People still don’t listen, but hey, at least we get to have fun with it.
[quote=“SteampunkBanana, post:18, topic:57158”]
You get to that point and they’ll be paying attention. But if it’s being done by rote, don’t be surprised you get tuned out.
[/quote]Er, yeah, thanks for the hot tip, but I know. Doesn’t mean we have one iota of control over it. These concerns have been raised over and over since the 90s, and they’re only JUST starting to turn around on it.
The closest you’re going to get is called “Stop talking and let me just watch the movie I have on my iPad.”
And I already covered why that’s not really a desirable solution. It’s the ciiiiiiircle of life…
