For anyone still debating the events of EG and why some of them are incredibly problematic as a story (at least in my opinion anyway). This piece on AICN is really spot on.
I find this statment particularly spot on as to why I think Endgame is ultimately more bad than good.
No one should have to walk out of a three-hour concluding chapter trying to work out how and why things happened the way they did. Worse, no one should be trying to do it during scenes demanding emotional investment.
His original review here:
one interesting thought about the off screen stuff…
So assuming Cap goes back to return the Reality Stone to where Rocket got it from…that means he either found a way to insert the stone (in its Aether form) back into Jane Foster…ewww…Or left the stone sitting there wherein wouldn’t the Asgardians look around wondering “Wait, how the hell did this get out of Foster?”
There are so many plot holes and devices in this film. And man alive I really do empathize with how difficult this was going to be for them to wrap up everything neatly. There are just so many head scratching moments. Even for a comic book film there are some whoppers in here.
Yeah, ekm, aka “Pretentious Filmmaker” (not kidding) is notorious for his epic Unpopular Takes. But as with all fun movies, YMMV.
but his follow up article (which was the one I was really calling attention to) is really spot on. He’s RIGHT in this case with what the issues are for Endgame. Him being a douchecanoe is not related.
No one should have to walk out of a three-hour concluding chapter trying to work out how and why things happened the way they did.
I think it’s perfectly fine to leave the audience with questions. Not everything has to be perfectly and completely explained, especially if the film maker expects the audience to be smart enough to connect the dots, or if they are purposefully holding something back. Sometimes part of the fun is working through things for yourself. And in a narrative that, 22 movies in, has been clearly established as ongoing, leaving unanswered questions is not necessarily a sign of bad film making. The MCU is a sort of weird multi-billion-dollar hybrid movie TV show … thing. If you break the films down into “seasons” based on their “phase”, then Endgame is the end of “season 3”. Even season finales leave some things unexplored to give the next season some threads to pick back up.
In particular, if the Russos do actually have answers to the question of what went on with Cap during his reverse fetch quest (or at least, if they’re willing to let on that they do), then I’m willing to accept that in Endgame, we got the beginning and end of a thread that could well be explored in the future, and I’m content with puzzling out what that thread could possibly be until we get an official answer. Again, that’s part of the fun.
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I think there is a difference between walking out of Total Recall and wondering “Was Quiad labotomized or was he really a spy?!” and the myriad of questions after EG “How Gamora? Who Gamora? Why Gamora?”.
Simple questions, or fun questions around interpretation of events is (to your point) can be some good story telling techniques. But in this case it is clearly sign of bad writing and the use of plot devices and hand waving to tie it all up in a nice neat little bow. “Oh well how did that character do this in the end?..Answer: Don’t worry about it, it just worked out fine that way. Move along.”
That’s never ok.
I don’t because, as has already been discussed, that requires Steve keeping quiet about some really shitty things happening over the years. I don’t want to think about this character (whom I love in these films) just sitting back while Bucky is tortured, that just ain’t Cap.
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Maybe he came to grips with the idea that he couldn’t alter elements of his own history that would prevent him from traveling back in time, so he made peace with the idea that he would eventually save Bucky circa 2014 and spent the intervening years helping the world by fighting secret battles that we never knew about. Like that time he stopped Dr. Doom from taking over the Western Hemisphere in 1967 or the time he prevented Earth from being consumed by Galactus in 1982. Wait, you never heard of those things? Of course not, that’s because he was really good at what he was doing.
Yeah, maybe and that’s the problem with this plot and why people are spending their time not talking about the story but about the inconsistent mechanics. Everyone seems to have their own way of dealing with this clumsy and frustrating plot by trying to squeeze it into their own personal canon, that’s yours and the other one is mine. I saw this and they seem to kinda address it but of course they don’t want to pre-empt future films.
Spoiler quote.
Q: Peggy Carter was probably already married and in her mid-40s in 1970, in that case, what year was it that Captain America went back to dance with her?
A: We can’t answer it, for now, this is a story that happened in an alternate reality. Maybe it will be revealed in the future.
Q: Did Captain America’s action at the end affect the timeline? Does that mean there was a time where two CA existed in a same universe?
A: To me, Captain America’s action in the end wasn’t the fact he wanted to change anything; it’s more like he has made a choice. He chose to go back to past and lived with the one he loved for the rest of his life. The time travel in this movie created an alternate reality. He lived a completely different life in that world. We don’t know how exactly his life turned out, but I’d like to believe he still helped many others when they were needed in that world. Yes, there were two CA in that reality, it’s just like what Hulk said, what happened in the past has already happened. If you go back to past, you simply created a new reality. The characters in this movie created new timeline when they went back to the past, but it had no effect to the prime universe. What happened in the past 22 movies was still canon.
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