This close to the election, there are a bunch of people who reluctantly support Trump because the see him as the lesser of two monsters. It looks like right now the polls are about evenly divided, so that is saying that 25% of voters are “deplorable”. They have received this distinction only because they have planned to vote Republican in this election. But as far as I can tell, almost all of the political violence going on right now is coming from people who earnestly believe that they are doing the right thing to oppose anyone supporting the Republicans. I think it is sad that people on both sides cannot understand that someone with differing political views might just see things from a slightly different perspective. There is no empathy. I have listened to a bunch of people lately who honestly believe that the people on the other side are either idiots or pure evil. “any reasonable and intelligent person would agree with me completely on political issues”.
I am probably excluded from these accusations because I will never support Trump.
If it were a “slightly different perspective” we wouldn’t be having this discussion. Why are we downplaying the nature of Trump’s platform, which is not a traditional Republican platform but the ideologies of a megalomaniac?
All of this “they’re both equally bad” rhetoric has arisen because there is no other defense for the man. For the sake of argument, Clinton’s bad insofar as she is a genuine career public servant–a politician–who has used the (for lack of better terms) standard maneuverings and manipulations to reach a higher echelon of government. Without that climb, she would not be there, nor would any past presidential candidate. It means she is capable of running America in the context of the wider world, that she can make a careful measured decision, and yes, spin the truth when it’s necessary for good relations.
Donald Trump is bad in that he actively loathes large demographic categories of people because of their race, gender, and/or beliefs; has never shown any skill in handling delicate situations with grace, tact, or wisdom; has already presumptuously proposed numerous executive actions that have been scorned by the rest of the world; and frankly doesn’t have the ability to keep a consistent thought in his head.
Those are two extraordinarily different definitions of “bad”, and only one of those definitions makes someone unfit–literally incapable–to hold the office of president.
I think history has been far kinder to Johnny Q than that genocidal monster who replaced him in office. Plus Sir Anthony Hopkins played him in that movie where he successfully fought a Supreme Court case on behalf of a bunch of escaped slaves.
(Granted, Hopkins also played Nixon in another movie so make of that honor what you will.)
It was sort of analogous to Trump’s “racists and murderers” comments about illegal immigrants from Mexico. He was explicitly talking about a subset of illegal immigrants, but a lot of people saw it as a claim about anyone of Mexican ethnicity, and they weren’t entirely wrong.
That being said I think Clinton was sincere in trying to draw a distinction between Trump’s deplorable supporters and his other supporters and I think that’s a fair and good idea. Trump is very unusual in that his base is the alt-right and his success was driven by racial resentment and that shouldn’t be forgotten as an issue. I think Clinton’s mistake was in explicitly referring to “half” of his supporters, while that may be an accurate number it ends up looking like she’s tarring the entire Republican party.
Donald Trump is bad in that he actively loathes large demographic categories of people because of their race, gender, and/or beliefs;
I am sorry, but so does Hillary. That’s what the person you are replying to wanted to say. She’s described about 25% of the voting public as deplorable which, if you translate from the mealy-mouthed language of the public statement is as vicious a condemnation you are likely to hear.
Those 25%? Yeah? Those are your compatriots. After November you are going to have to work with these people. Build a country with them because there’s no ignoring them, no avoiding them. There’s plenty of them no matter who wins. They are an important voting bloc, no matter who wins. If you want democracy that’s what it costs.
I’m a foreigner, it’s ultimately no skin off my nose who wins in November, since on foreign policy the candidates are twin cauldrons of malign intent. But I’ve spent months now watching soi-disant liberals engage in two minutes’ hate against Trump supporters. You may say that you only hate them ‘cos they are so hateful (some, undoubtedly are, the ones I’ve personally met seemed as genial as folks as any I’ve come across, despite me being a suspiciously-colored dangerous furrin’-type person but that is a tiny, tiny sample) but, tell me, aren’t you supposed to be the ones who are better than this sort of thing?
(so does) Hillary actively loathes large demographic categories of people because of their race, gender, and/or beliefs? Sorry, you’re stretching there buddy. The truth is 'Merica has a long history of collective conflict toward sexism and racism which is still in-progress. Regardless of whether or not racists and sexists are our co-patriots, their views are directly at odds with the written and implied spirit of what the union is founded on, and those views are exactly those we need to fight against. It’s not so impressive to hear an someone marginalize that energy so easily, particularly someone who has “nothing to lose”.
I understand the urge to badmouth that orange buffoon and I really see the urgent need to support Clinton in her effort to get elected. Unfortunately I think we should also be preparing for how to respond if trump gets elected because I fear he has a damn good chance. Its always a bad idea to bet against stupid. I know a lot of people who have fallen for the Smear The Clintons campaign that started back in the 90. They plan to throw their vote away rather than support Hillary. As close as the race is the wasted votes may very well put the trump in office.
It may be that we should be figuring out ways to counter the damage he will do to our nation. Maybe we should come to grips with the distinct possibility that he will win. The hatred of the right wing that’s been festering for years may well pop and squirt it’s vile toxin all over us. Having a plan B may minimize some of the inevitable damage if the fool does win. And even if he loses it’s a sure bet he won’t lose gracefull
You misunderstand me. I’m not talking about energy. I’m talking about how as much as you dislike these people, you can’t hate them away. There’s a lot of them and the deal of democracy is that their opinions count. And not just until they are defeated: even after Hillary is elected (which she will be) she’s their president too.
I’m not saying that they are your compatriots to inspire you towards warmth and fuzzy feelings, I’m saying that building a better future of less classism, and sexism, and racism and so forth is something you have to do with these people. There’s nobody else to do it with.
Calling them deplorable is just counterproductive.
I wrote all of the above and the original comment as well because I keep seeing these sudden explosions of pure hate which puzzle me. It’s not like once Trump loses, as it’s pretty definite he will, all of the people who voted for him will just vanish or be sent to camps or something. They’ll keep on existing and having the same opinions, and they’ll remember what was said about them, damaging any possibility of compromise in the future.
Perhaps you’re seeing hatred where there is intolerance and passion.
There are plenty of issues worth compromising over. But racism, etc is not one of them. Meaningful social change for the better comes despite those who oppose it, not in concord with them. There are too many examples in US history: the civil rights movement, women’s right, etc. What make these powerful and inspirational moments is that they happened against great adversary. If what you are saying is true: that those who are on the losing side of these battles don’t disappear, then you must think that people in the US, on a whole, think the same as they did when these movements happened.
