Continuing coronavirus happenings (Part 2)

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Headline’s on point.

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This bothers me on a number of points. The ethics of it, of course, but also because the very nature of it excludes those who we most need to know if it works in. Great if it works in young, healthy, vigorous people, but older, more vulnerable and debilitated people are the ones we need to know it works in, and this will not answer that. Also, while younger people are less likely to die, there is no evidence that they are less likely to suffer long term cardiac, neurological or psychiatric consequences. And less likely is a statistical statement that says precious little about an individual. So yeah, ethically questionable, not so effective in determining what actually needs to be determined, and likely to give a skewed and incomplete result. Not my idea of a good idea. Of course, no one asked me, so here we go…

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Dolly to the rescue again

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Has she been canonized yet?

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Ok, my idea is to create something like a DNR. Some anti-maskers printed out cards using a false organization or mangled interpretations of the law while trying to exempt themselves from public health regulations. This would be a real card that they could use and share with others who follow conspiracy theories and anti-science media outlets.

Showing the card to medical professionals would allow them to stop treating these folks. That would free their time and energy for those who want treatment and believe the virus is real. However, those people would not be released to infect others. Instead, the hospitals would transfer them to facilities where they could be monitored and kept from wandering. I suggest we call these places Molokai Mindfulness* Centers.

The centers for people whose minds are full of scary and harmful ideas.

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Durability of immunity aside, this this this is what has been eating at me for many months now.
Thank you for articulating it:

A culture that sacrifices its young is a death culture. Full stop.

Even the indigenous peoples of the Americas, in their heyday, with human sacrifices atop stone pyramids, did not have the kind of organized vast reach that these global vaccine trials had / have / will have, nor the kind of long-term consequences that are certain to emerge on the timeline of those who survive.

I am convinced that entire health care systems and practices will not be able to withstand those long-term consequences in their current form. If we in the U.S. do not change the way our health care “system” :roll_eyes: “works” :roll_eyes: :roll_eyes: here, it will have devastating effects on every single aspect of how U.S.ians live, work, play, create, (dare I say “think”?) and die.

I sense these effects will be inescapable in nations where the [current] pandemic was mishandled.

May the gods, goddesses, saints and sentient beings have mercy on us all.

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After this past spring and summer, when seniors in institutions and incarcerated people were given substances scientists knew wouldn’t work against the virus, any little faith I had that TPTB were concerned about medical ethics is long gone.

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Pharma has had the bottom line as its primary decision point forever. I had been hoping the medical professionals would maintain some trace of ethics, but I am probably over generous / overly optimistic in that.

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As a thought experiment, some friends and I had discussed.
So… there are these cards, already out in the wild, unfortunately:

… et tu, Canada?!? :

… and there’s this issue that HCW are facing ad infinitum:

https://www.vumc.org/coronavirus/latest-news-you-asked-we-answered/what-do-i-do-if-patient-refuses-wear-their-mask

(My suggestion that such people be tattooed with “refuses mask” on their anti-mask-y foreheads was not taken for the kind of genius move that this so clearly is, among my doc friends here in Texas.

/sarcasm )

Related, then, inevitably, is this discussion:

… because hey if they signed the dang waiver at one of those MAGA rallies… then the logical consequences at the very least should… ought… something-something…

If a U.S. president is having his staff pass COVID waivers around at MAGA rallies, surely then your pitch for those “mindfulness centers” is just one more waiver and makes complete sense even if it would be ethically and legally hard to enforce.

But oh hey look “laws” yes actual anti-mask laws because: reasons:

On the horizon, this discussion (that doesn’t Onebox properly) of whether anti-maskers should be entitled to the precious vaccine once available, which will be in short supply for a while:

ETA: grammar

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Why shouldn’t he? There will never be consequences for his actions:

(Both via Atrios)

I should also point to this analysis:

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Americans may be too toxic for vaccines to survive in our bodies.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/17/chemicals-found-in-everyday-products-could-hinder-covid-19-vaccine

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And the doctors are also worried about the mental health effects in all children.

With lead gone from gasoline, we have to make new Republicans somehow.

Those most likely to suffer the most from the disease and pandemic are Black and Hispanic children, the AAP notes. Black and Hispanic children are suffering higher rates of infection and severe disease, and they may be more vulnerable to economic harms and disruptions to educational and social services.

Working as intended. Remember this every time Scott Atlas opens his lie hole.

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Nearly posted without further comment…

Brave and tricky article. Many, perhaps most, of the single family homes built up in the area in question are immediately turned into multi-family dwellings. So, along with the unexpected demand for schools, how long before we have pandemic by-laws to go with the fire regulations about such uses? It does point to the need for a housing policy informed to some real extent by pandemic considerations.

I’ll concede it’s not an immediate policy consideration, but it would be a shame to lose it in the long term.

@Ratel With lead gone from gasoline, we have to make new Republicans somehow.

Normally I try not to comment on :us: politics, but… ouch… :face_with_hand_over_mouth:

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Just like masks, the vaccine doesn’t just benefit them. It benefits everyone who would be infected by them.

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Given the overwhelming whiteness of the movement, and for the moment disregarding the huge overlap with antivaxxers, they will most likely assume they should actually be given preference in vaccine distribution. I kid not, hide and wait.

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Or when anyone suggests reconciliation with “former” Trump supporters.

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Careful what you wish for.

Also, it seems that the Trump admin can put this in their books. The US government has gambled here with their funding, since AFAIR, moderna does not have a history in developing successful vaccines.

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