Nooo… Just thrown down the street. They were never in my possession.
You’re missing a point. As tempting as it is to assume that it’s always about me, I have had people tell me, explicitly, that they know what they were doing was unlawful, and were going to continue doing it anyway. Also, these were often egregious offenses which brought immediate danger, such as a road rager getting mad enough to drive back and forth, deliberately trying to run me over. So yes, making sure they guy would be on his hands and knees looking for his keys five minutes later instead of running me over seemed like a prudent choice.
I also accidentally lit a drivers pants on fire once! Somebody I didn’t know was driving along side me, and flicked half a lit cigarette in my face. My reflexes were crazy fast, so I just grabbed it in mid-air and threw it back at him. It landed on his lap and he pulled over, getting out of a smoky car to pour a drink on his groin. I certainly didn’t want it to happen, but it was some funny shit. Being a bike messenger was more “Road Warrior” than “Judge Dredd”, very fast and very dangerous. It was a great experience, but I am happy to not do it aymore.
If they’re forming a new microstate, shouldn’t they make their own roads since they didn’t help pay for the ones they’re on and they are opting out of that system of governance and taxation?
Too much talk about sovereignty and secession centers around tax avoidance. More important than deciding to not spend money is to get what you pay for. But, to be fair, when I put my time, money, and effort into local infrastructure - the state was pretty eager to avoid paying me also.
I’m sorry, was that “Yes, I will use these roads that the government I’ve opted out of makes” or “No, I won’t use the roads and infrastructure that the other society that I mysteriously cohabitate with creates”?
I’m afraid the former sounds like “I dispute the right of this government to pass laws that affect me and refuse to abide by them but, oh yes, I’ll use its roads, electricity, fire department, banks, currency, and so forth.”
Otherwise, just as you do if you get a license to drive a car, by using said infrastructure or banks, you’re agreeing to the rules that come with them, right? That would be consistent with your stance on licensing.
I don’t see it as government versus me. The way I see it, everybody is the government - there is no difference. Using “its” infrastructure is natural because we are making it ourselves. I told you that this is what DIY is all about. I don’t want to make pretty crafts or useless electronic widgets. What I am going for is exactly DIY “roads, electricity, fire department, banks, currency, and so forth” That is the whole point!
Exactly. Going along with stuff you don’t agree with sets bad precedent, which is why many of the bOINGers here lament their lack of input in the running of the world.
I refuse to derail the topic! I said what I needed to about bikes and traffic!
Yes, you did and I tell you that if you continue to assault people by reaching into their cars to steal their keys, they will probably react violently and assume that you are attacking them. Good luck with that.
If I assault them, they will think I am attacking them? This sounds like circular reasoning. How can people “assume” that I am attacking them if I am not?
And if they are attacking me, why should I be particularly bothered by what they think about it? I am pretty sure that deliberately running somebody over with your car is assault also - and all they have to do to get out of it (if there are no witnesses) is to say “I didn’t see them”. I don’t consider myself to be a violent person, but if I have to choose between risking damage to a person’s life, or another person’s property - then the property it is. Also, I do not mind forcibly restraining violent people, because it can be safer than the alternative.
My experience has suggested to me that the encapsulated environment of the automobile works as a kind of psychological barrier for many drivers, which they assume separates themselves from others, and perhaps the consequences of their actions. So they tend to be more willing to use their vehicle as a weapon and bully their way than they would when out in the open. With some people, even something so much as touching their car causes intense anxiety. But sometimes that barrier fails them! Opening that door or window for a chat can be scary, but it also often breaks people out of their trance of separateness which inspired their reckless behavior.
The point being that reaching into someone’s car and taking their keys will be seen as assault and, legally perhaps, as theft. Expect a commiserate reaction.
They aren’t going to care about reasoning. If someone did it to me, I wouldn’t. I’d assume the worst and proceed from there.
This is assuming a lot. If a person is being violent with their vehicle, and not making safe decisions, should I assume that it actually is their own vehicle? A safe question to start with might be: “Is this your car?” If their answer is “FAHK YOU YA FAHKIN ASSHOLE! I FAHKIN KILL YA! I FAHKIN KILL YA!” then this is by no means a foregone conclusion, and meanwhile they state an intent to kill me. Granted, I do prefer less legal ambiguity, but they seem to be on shaky ground here. By refusing to act, couldn’t I be considered partly culpable if someone were to be hurt?
(Assuming here that you meant a commensurate reaction)
Well, I would hope that you wouldn’t put people in such a situation to begin with. Do you usually chase people from within your car? Someone who is actively endangering people makes clear that they aren’t reasoning very well to begin with.
Wow - that video is crazy. It always amazes me how irate some people in the US get about filtering (as we call lane splitting) in traffic - in the UK you’re taught about filtering when you learn to drive a car - it’s perfectly normal and expected. Frankly, I was really impressed with the restraint of the motorcyclist in dealing with the guy who attacked him and his girlfriend. I’m not sure I’d have been as calm/restrained as him in that situation.
Thank you! I can’t stand not knowing what happens next in these videos. I wish there was a boingboing+1, which’d run a week behind and have follow-ups to the follow-upable stories.
Ha! You’ve never driven on the 101 between Mountain View and San Fran, have you? They totally lane split when traffic is moving along. You just learn to deal with it.
I think it varies from state to state. IIRC off road vehicles on private property, like dirt bikes, don’t have to be registered in Kansas. I may be mistaken about that, or the law has changed, but I knew many people on rural farms who had dirt bikes and ATVs they drove at young ages with no licenses. When they got moped to ride to school they had to get plates and licensed.
Also, just like to point out that licensing and registration still doesn’t stop people from being stupid with their vehicles. Every day I see people who supposedly know the rules, but still try to kill one another. Hand to god, I was 99% sure I was going to be in a wreck last week when a guy changed lanes into another person 2 cars ahead. I saw it start to happen and started to brake hard. To me it looked like he missed the other car by inches.
