Drums of War

It’s also quite interesting to think about the further fate of seized weapons of war. That’s not quite straightforward.

I have no german beyond knowing how to say (but not write) “write it down please” so I had to rely on google translate for that article.

As I see that, it comes down to the EU Mandarins launched an operation with a half baked plan. This comes as no surprise to me considering what I know of EU efforts to interdict the flow of migrants and drugs across the Mediterranean which seem to be similarly half baked: “interdict and stop but after that we don’t have a plan”.

I think your summary based on GT is correct (ok, they DID think about it, but didn’t fix a deal - and throwing it in the sea like they apparently do in a joint operation with the US off the Somali coast is out of the question), but my point is actually that it’s friggin’ hard to get rid of weapons of war.

If you don’t want them to end up in another conflict/war, its a nightmare to properly dispose of them. And the amount described in your link - woah. I can easily see that this stuff is NOT going to the bottom of the sea anywhere.

Based on what friends have told me, its not hard to get rid of anything short of N/B/C weapons, you just need a plan for it including teams who know how to do it right. Obviously plan includes budget. The actual getting rid of em does involve either dropping them down a hole, taking them apart and/or some boom.

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There lies the problem.

Dropping them somewhere postpones several problems, but doesn’t solve them, I think. Boom is a problem in its own right, environmentally as well as technically. And taking them apart with the purpose to actually make sure they are not reassembled means also burning the chemical part. In a further furnace-style thing with proper exhaust filters, see environmental problem above.

Really fucking expensive.

Western Germany had quite some problems with the stuff the NVA had, after the reunification. I’d thought there would be a striving industry by now, and competition lowering the prices. But apparently, it’s still a financial and logistical problem.

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For all the unexploded volitile ordinance they keep finding all over Germany, you’d think out of all of Europe at least they would have it down by now.

Seriously though according to a USMC family member, for all the lack of big picture after battle planning the US lacked in Iraq 2, the Marines at least did have enough ordinance disposal crew, budget & training.

I still think the problem here is Eurocrat Half-bakery.

As you said at the start it’s actually mostly cost.

i.e. member state problem - not eurocrat.

Part of the problem here is that some of the stuff may need to be kept, some disposed of.

The military are saying the funding they’ve been provided isn’t enough to cover it so want more money.

The member states don’t want to fund it but do want the ships going up and down and stopping those nasty migrants from landing.

So, yeah - lack of planning to an extent (who knew that if you look for stuff, you might find it?), the usual mission creep and governmental penny-pinching. Mostly the latter since the rest would be solvable via the application of money.

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If a member state participates in an EU plan, does no one in the member state check the plan? As you say, if you look for things, something will be found and finding means dealing with what was found.

Again since this is known in advance why wasn’t it in the plan? Also same question as above.

100%

Where is the creep? Also do said govts not run the plans by their own military to at least ask “does this look right to you?” Was the plan and money there at the start but budget withdrawn later?

No.

Only semi-serious answer.

Ask and ye shall receive :slight_smile:

Initial mission - putter up and down and try and stop cute toddlers washing up dead on beaches on the ‘right’ side of the Med and upsetting holiday makers.

Mission creep - enforce the UN arms embargo.

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Sadly I’m not surprised. I typed and deleted at least three really good rants that would have maybe made a Legionnaire blush.

Jumping Jehosephat! I knew Operation Sophia was poorly planned from the beginning (the “3 phases” do not include what to do with the migrants on the ships) but the double mission creep parts are head desk to concussion level bad. Pure madness.

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sanders-what-are-you-on-about

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Coming back to my original thought, what is going to happen with all that fireworks found destined for Egypt, from the Korean Peninsula, with love?

WaPo only says

In any case, the February U.N. report on the incident sidesteps the question of who was meant to receive the rockets, saying only that the munitions were destroyed by Egypt under U.N. supervision

I expect the U.N. supervision included a fair amount of Americans & British people with experience in this kind of thing. Folks who have a tradition of experience in disposal of copies of old Soviet & Chinese arms.

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The ANZAC Memorial in Sydney.

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It’s a beautiful hallowed spot.

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The sculpture is titled Sacrifice.

It was controversial when installed; the veterans approved, but the conservative politicians felt that it was too anti-war.

The original design was also supposed to include another two sculptures outside. The conservatives managed to pressure them into leaving those out.

This is one:

64A7D05B-14C8-4C9C-9848-A8633E7A2F7E

It was called The Crucifixion of Civilisation.

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https://twitter.com/rtyson82/status/916100121271635970

https://twitter.com/kaitlancollins/status/916094293068140550

https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/916098893120753665

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One hundred years ago.

All in one day, and just one day after the end of Polygon Wood:

The Australian population at the time was less than five million people. Do the math.

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https://twitter.com/simonmaloy/status/916014483784425472

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