Interview with family that crashed dad's BBC interview


#1

Originally published at: http://boingboing.net/2017/03/15/interview-with-family-that-cra.html


#2

Gosh, nice family. What’s he do for work again?


#3

I believe he’s a professor. I want to say Korean studies.


#4

So many people were so sure that she was staff. I wonder which detail it might have been that made people jump to that conclusion.


#5

Here’s a counterpoint to the “harmless fun” narrative: http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/media/2017/03/bbc-pundits-children-video-not-funny-its-patriarchy-nutshell


#6

Good parents take turns at taking care of the kids. If you see someone on TV, you can expect they are on the job and that their spouse is currently the one dealing with the kids. In a few hours those roles can easily reverse.

Pointing out a bias and patriarchy without all the facts is very ignorant. Everyone wants to color in their own narrative, for good or bad. But really we don’t know the details of the family to judge. And most importantly, we have no right to judge.


#7

Yeah, there is enough discrimination, bias, and unequal expectations in the world to go around, no need to extrapolate what bad sentiments you might imagine are behind a few seconds of footage on a video.

The only thing approaching a coherent point is the claim that if the roles were reversed people would be complaining about what a bad mother just pushes her kid away like that because she is busy. And that would be wrong. So is complaining about this gentleman doing the same.


#8

Ah yes, the evil MAN not turning away from the camera during an interview slot that was likely 90 seconds long at most, never mind the fact that he could actually see his daughter on the screen (he says that outright during the follow-up and you can easily confirm this by starting up Skype yourself).

Having had the pleasure of trying to keep an active toddler away from my wife’s office while she’s in the middle of an interview, I assure any who care to read this, I would be just as panicked-looking if my toddler had escaped during that time. I don’t think this makes me an exemplary father or a brave rebel striking a blow against The Patriarchy. I think it makes me not an inconsiderate asshole.

But hey, by all means let’s fill in the gaps to suit our narrative of reality. Because of course, valid examples of the patriarchy are very hard to come by – at the very least as hard as are non-bullshit outrage news topics.


#9

Crashed… or crushed?


#10

But they don’t, at least not equally. The only parenting task that men, on average, spend more time doing than women is driving the kids places. Otherwise, women shoulder the vast majority of the effort, regardless of employment status.

[quote=“OrangeTide, post:6, topic:97108, full:true”] If you see someone on TV, you can expect they are on the job and that their spouse is currently the one dealing with the kids.
[/quote]
No, you shouldn’t expect this. The vast majority of talking pundits on TV are male. There’s a reason for this. And when you do see a woman pundit, most times there’s a nanny or childminder with the kids.

[quote=“OrangeTide, post:6, topic:97108, full:true”] In a few hours those roles can easily reverse.
[/quote]
“Can easily” doesn’t mean “will”.

How many facts do you need? There is a huge body of academic research on gender roles in society. Ignorance of this research is ignorant.

The details of the family are tangental. The article I pointed to was about societal norms and attitudes.

[quote=“OrangeTide, post:6, topic:97108, full:true”]And most importantly, we have no right to judge.
[/quote]
We all have a right to criticize societal norms and attitudes, and, arguably, a duty to work to change them when equity is at stake. But I think that’s not what you meant, when you were hastily missing the point.


#11

Say what now?


#12

That was a painful read.

“Basically, the message this video delivers to me is: being a man is playing life on the easy setting.”

Yeah stake your profession on things like non-paid exposure on the BBC and then have this happen to you. Given he has a work office he is likely also taking care of the kids when the mother has something important to the survival of the family.

I prefer Ben thompsons Blow by blow take:

Here’s the deal: the male ego is both remarkably fragile and remarkably easy to satiate. Tell said ego he will be featured as an expert in front of a national or global audience and he will do whatever it takes — including 12 years of academia and wearing a suit at home—to ensure it is so.

Also the way the little girl dances into the video is a wonder to behold and she is a thing of pure awesome.


#13

Man… this article takes what is a very common occurrence in pretty much any household with a child/children, and turns it into some other thing with all this extra baggage.

Here’s the problem: I can’t enjoy it.

I am guessing the author doesn’t have children, which is probably key in relating to the story. 20 something me would probably feel the same either.

Gee, my ex-wife would some times work from home, and she too would have to do her best to ignore our little one while on a call or in the middle of work. And I was the one who had to scramble and snatch her away. And then later that night I tried to churn out some freelance work while she entertained our child. Though I’d be the one getting up at 2am, and 3:30am, and 5am, and 6am, etc

And a final note, even if they don’t have a 50/50 parental role, many couples are happy with a “traditional” arrangement or a hybrid of the two. Pretty hard to figure out 1) what arrangement is and 2) one’s happiness with it from a <30 second video clip.


#14

FWIW, you can get a free link to the article on the WSJ twitter feed. (I’d post the link, but then it would probably get boinged.)


#15

The sarcasm tag doesn’t render very obviously in all user-agents.


#16

Ah. Upon rereading, I think I see that now, thanks. (Not that I think it’s a dude’s rightful task to police a woman’s calling-outs of patriarchal behavior. But then, I’m not sure after reading that article that it too wasn’t satire/sarcasm. Sheesh, where’s the exit from this rabbit hole? )


#17

I wonder what they would have said when my Mom was spanking me or washing my mouth out with Ivory soap as a child? heheh


#18

For me, my first assumption was wife. Then on second viewing of her flying in as though her life or livelihood depended on it made me wonder if she wasn’t staff.
Her slide was awesome!


#19

We all have a right to criticize societal norms and attitudes, and, arguably, a duty to work to change them when equity is at stake. But I think that’s not what you meant, when you were hastily missing the point.

Two way street. I say you don’t have the right to judge another family. It’s definitely my right to point that out. And it’s ignorant of you to apply your assumptions against an individual family.

There are definitely trends in society that we must examine and move to correct. There is an imbalance in the family responsibilities of the sexes in our society. But that’s an average among millions of people. It’s ignorant to assume that one situation must match the typical situation. And it’s insulting to apply a summary judgement on a family you know nothing about.


#20

One thing you’ve failed to consider are cultural differences. In a rapidly-changing, post-colonial, Cold War, homogenous monoculture like South Korea-- which has both long traditional roots and has liberalized differences among generations-- the social negotiation of marriage cannot be readily defined with Western stereotypical terms like “patriarchy.”

You do need to know the details. I know, because I lived there almost a decade. A husband in a Korean mixed-marriage has very few “patriarchal” advantages: as a foreigner he has little Korean social-group support (except his secondary stature as a professor), and he cannot navigate Korea using Western presumptions about marriage. Although interracial marriages have recently become trendy in Korea, marriage between cultures requires broad-mindedness from both husband and wife.

Robert Kelly did a press conference for the Korean media which was mostly a positive boost for his employer, and reflected Korean idealism about his marriage. I refer you to these websites for the general Korean perspective on the video:

http://news.nate.com/view/20170315n29228

If you wish to talk about the reasons why a Western feminist viewpoint makes little sense in non-Western cultures, we can discuss further.