Justice Department sues Hobby Lobby over thousands of looted Iraqi artifacts it bought

[LeopardSeal]

@Mister44

So wait - were theses for the stores or something else?

If you guessed giant “bible museum”, you are today’s winner!

[One_Brown_Mouse]

@Taniwha

it’s a strange world

One wants us in the 11th century, the other in the 14th. Not so different really.

[One_Brown_Mouse]

@nungesser

from the English Standard Version, a fairly recent literal translation.

Did they leave out the ‘shalt not steal’ part?

[Woodchuck45]

@Mister44

(Although, lots of National Museums have “looted” items from conquests and wars and other things. The British National Museum has an amazing collection from around the world, and it wasn’t all just donated )

Yet it takes more than an act of Parliament to return some of the stolen…er…looted…er…colonially appropriated materials.

Greece calls for return of 'Elgin Marbles' to help fight rise of fascism in...

At least some museums understand that their displayed material doesn’t belong to them and have done the right thing:

Aphrodite Statue’s Last Days at the Getty Before Return to Italy

[Mangochin]

Great obscure movie reference! (The reference is obscure, not the movie)

[Quinquennial]

@beschizza

Hobby Lobby markets itself as a Christian company and famously took the government to court to secure a religious exemption from providing insurance plans that covered birth control.

It should be said that while there’s nothing in the Bible about abortion, there’s at least one in ten commands against lying.

[anon55609254]

@nungesser

That sounds like straight-up proselytizing to me, but hey, it’s a private museum, they can tell whatever story they want to tell.

Have you seen the Visitors’ Center in Temple Square in Salt Lake City? The nice young man who showed us around assured us that the “Jews were the only ones to kill their own God.” Quite a story, that.

[robertmckenna]

I don’t understand all the snark about this not being “christian” behaviour: Christians have been looting Muslim countries for c.1000yrs… /s

[Footface]

I think their female employees could still have health care, just not EVIL, SATANIC contraception.

Because their Bible tells them that levonorgestrel, ulipristal acetate, and IUDs prevent the implantation of fertilized eggs. Also, their Bible says that preventing implantation is the same as abortion.

Also they ignore the parts of the Bible that appear not to care about abortion, but whatever.

[One_Brown_Mouse]

@Quinquennial

there’s at least one in ten commands against lying.

This week only at Hobby Lobby, 10% off Everything!

[hecep]

$3M fine. YES!!!

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/07/05/535698988/hobby-lobby-to-forfeit-smuggled-iraqi-antiquities

[nungesser]

@hecep

$3M fine. YES!!!

Given that they’re a $4 billion dollar corporation who spent millions on these antiquities that likely went right into the pockets of ISIS, I wish that a few zeros had been added to that pittance of a fine.

[Brainspore]

Matt Pearce 🦅 (mattdpearce)

[One_Brown_Mouse]

that’s better than one of Bob Loblaws Law Blog Law Bombs!

[anon61221983]

@Mister44

Well, like I said, I am more worried about preservation.

Me to. But as someone else upthread noted (I think @Spizella), these objects have already been decontextualized from it’s surroundings. Getting an artifact without knowing where it was found and what it was found with (among other things) isn’t really effectively preserving it. Their meanings were likely going to be made to fit with whatever right wing religious bat-shittery the hobby lobby dude had in mind. It is good that they aren’t destroyed, that’s very true. But there has already been considerable damage done. I’d also question whether or not the hobby lobby folks have good museum training. I mean, honestly, even reputable museums (like various national museums in western capitals) have historically had a huge problem with taking artifacts and relics that do not belong to them (especially in the era of high imperialism, the Victorian era). Countries like Iraq, Egypt, Turkey, and Iran are still fighting to get some of their antiquities back.

@Mister44

Still ideally they never would have been looted in the first place.

I think we can all agree there.

[anon61221983]

@nungesser

a fairly recent literal translation.

Literal meaning bent to their particular religious ideological world view!

[anon61221983]

@robertmckenna

Christians have been looting Muslim countries for c.1000yrs

Well, actually…

[Mister44]

@anon61221983

Getting an artifact without knowing where it was found and what it was found with (among other things) isn’t really effectively preserving it.

That’s true, but that is the looters doing. Assuming it was looted from the ground vs looted from an archive somewhere. In which case records on it should exist. But that is the main issue with people looting historic sites for personal gain. That is why that cave with the giant crystals in Mexico (or was it South America) has been kept secret.

@anon61221983

I mean, honestly, even reputable museums (like various national museums in western capitals) have historically had a huge problem with taking artifacts and relics that do not belong to them (especially in the era of high imperialism, the Victorian era).

Yes, I pointed out that some awesome collections like the British National Museum has some ill gotten samples. And you’re right that preservation has been spotty in the past. I would hope that any modern museum would have trained archivers.

@anon61221983

Their meanings were likely going to be made to fit with whatever right wing religious bat-shittery the hobby lobby dude had in mind.

I dunno, I guess this seems like an hyperbolic low blow. But you may be right.

[anon61221983]

@Mister44

but that is the looters doing.

But they might stop doing it if they couldn’t make $$$ off them.

@Mister44

I dunno, I guess this seems like an hyperbolic low blow. But you may be right.

We are talking about a company that went all the way to the supreme court in order to deny women access to birth control. I think that’s pretty religious bat shit, but I guess that depends on how much you think women should have complete control over their bodies. For me, it’s a pretty hard line.

[Mister44]

@anon61221983

But they might stop doing it if they couldn’t make $$$ off them.

Yeah, well, if it has value people steal it. From drugs, to artifacts to car stereos - hell to scrap copper! I know a guy who had a house stripped of all the wires and pipes in his house! Ugh I hate thieves.

@anon61221983

I think that’s pretty religious bat shit,

Ok, fair point.